Suggestions on how to determine the exact cost of supporting SD?
All the recent child support posts have inspired me to come up with a statement for us to give BM as to what it costs to support SD.
I had planned to do so back in May when the court ordered BM to pay support, but then, she still hasn't paid support so I don't feel bad I haven't done it yet.
I think it should have a breakdown of our total bills (because BM has no idea what it really means to support yourself) and realistically how much is due to SD. Then of course, all the additional stuff just for SD.
I want it to be fair, like DH and I would have liked to see when he was paying CS to BM. WHere the money really goes. Or, would go if she were paying it.
I found a website with average cost for each category such as housing, transportation, food etc. But that just doesn't seem good enough for me. I want to use our own bills to be accurate.
What is the best way to determine how much of the house payment and utilities would be because of SD? She's only 4, but then we have more bedrooms=bigger house payment, more food and utilities.
To tell the truth, DH and I were never seeking child support from BM, just safety for SD.
We don't feel to guilty though, thinking back on how DH paid on time for so long while BM lived free off her parents, then denied DH his visitation when she would forget to check the mail for her CS check.
BM has not made a single payment on time, has paid only 100 by money order, 115 taken out of one check, then not a dime since. In May it will be a year since she was first ordered to pay.
ANd yet, she has had all of her visitation, and not a single complaint by DH or myself.
THank you for any input.
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I would go through all of your bills
that you have had since you gained custody of SD. What foods does she like to eat and how much do they cost at the grocery store? How much do her pediatrician's visits cost? How much do her dentist's visits cost? How much does her medicine cost? How much does her preschool cost? How much gas $$$ do you spend transporting her from place to place? How often do you buy clothes & shoes for her, where do you buy them and how much do they cost? How much do you spend on stuff she has in her room (bed, blanket, furniture)? How much do you spend on her extracurricular activities like swimming lessons? You get the idea. Add up all those numbers and that will be your answer. I know, it's a lot of work. But like you said, if you go by your own bills, your answer will be accurate.
My SDs BM hasn't made many of her payments on time either. All I can say is document each time she doesn't make her payment on time. If you could take her to court she could be penalized for going against the court's orders. Does SD's BM work? My SDs' BM doesn't and more often than not BM's parents pay her child support.
luckily here in Texas it is
luckily here in Texas it is supposed to all go through the state child support unit, so they always have an accurate amount she owes.
no, coincidentally BM has not worked since right after the first and only payment was witheld from her check.
And the only reason that happened was DH and I finding where she was working and notifying the CS office.
Thank you for the input, you're right I just need to crunch the numbers.
Two roads diverged in a yellow wood, and I---
I took the one less traveled by,
and that made all the difference. -Robert Frost-
fair
In order to be fair and balanced I would take the number of people in the house and divide the mortgage, utilities and food by that number. If she were a roommate there that would be her portion to pay.
How much do you spend per month on what she needs? Not what she wants but what she needs; clothes, medicine, doctor visits, school supplies and anything else that is just for her. Add up the total for a couple of months and then divide it by the number of months to get the mean and that should give you a general idea.
Thanks,
That sounds good to me, I was just afraid of it seeming unfair because DH and I are adults and SD is only 4. But hey, it sure seems SD uses more than Dh and I when it comes to water and electric, maybe 1/4 would be more than fair to estimate!
Not that I am complaining, I am just so happy to have SD with us. I consider the cost of supporting her the LEAST we can do for her considering the mess of a mother she has.
I just want something to show BM. She shouldn't be able to complain as it is, we already agreed that she not be ordered to pay nearly as much as the state would have it. And we didn't even ask that it be retroactive for all the time DH had sole custody in temporary orders while BM was ordered supervised visitation in our home(so never had possessin in which she supported SD in any way) and we had not asked for support from her in the temporary orders so it would be obvious to the court that was not our goal in getting primary custody.
I guess I really should take a look back at our bills from when we only had SD extended Standard and compare to now and see what looks different.
I thought for sure I would be able to google and find a worksheet or example of a statement type thing to give the NCP who pays CS. NOPE.
One thing I did agree with on that you tube CS thing is how silly it is that in the US if the government gives out money they want to see and through food stamps partially control how the money is spent, but on the contrary where child support is concerned. THey order it paid, but no one is held accountable for how it is spent.
I am so thankful DH and I are now on the receiving end of CS (or are at least supposed to be), ANd I do not have any problems with having to account for where the support goes, in fact I welcome it, as I have been on the other side with DH.
I'm sorry for all of you who have paid for so long who have a BM or other party with no experience being the payor of CS, if they are only ever on the receiving end they really have no idea and can be such jerks!
Two roads diverged in a yellow wood, and I---
I took the one less traveled by,
and that made all the difference. -Robert Frost-
That's a good point
so much of this all comes down to individual choices and abilities.
I think you're right about the room thing Danyelle, at the moment BM is providing SD her own room there also, but barely. And it's really only to store SD's things because SD still sleeps with BM when she is there. Still, it does not cost BM less just because SD is with us the majority of the time.
I should only include housing for SD as an expense if BM is not providing SD a room when she is with her. Such as if BM downsizes to a one bedroom apartment instead of a two, or if she moves in with her mom and is not paying housing at all. At least that kinda makes sense I think.
Like I said, it still comes down to choices. Like I do not think BM should have to pay more just because DH and I choose to live in a house instead of an apartment. But then, our choice to live in a house and pay a mortgage and all the expenses that come along with home ownership were and are directly related to providing SD the safety and back yard that we feel come along with it.
At least the home seems to be a good investment for the benifit of SD, where some people could do otherwise and choose to live in a dump because it is cheap, and spend the extra money on a fancy car for themselves.
Don't get me wrong, reliable transportation for SD is important, but to cause SD to go without a bedroom because BM thinks she is too good for a perfectly decent Malibu is selfish.
This is getting complicated.
Two roads diverged in a yellow wood, and I---
I took the one less traveled by,
and that made all the difference. -Robert Frost-
Oh, these
guys know how much it costs.
They know how much they don't have.
They like watching you wriggle around on the hook until you figure it out. I think of a lot of them are con artists.
I would not do it if I was you.
Only for the reason that TMI (To Much Information) is something that can come back to bite you in the buttocks in future.
I would just contact the CS enforcement office and request direct payroll withholding for the CS she owes and be done with the discussion and drama. In many if not most states employers are required to withhold CS from pay checks and submit the money to the state for distribution to the CP.
For reference purposes you can do a quick and simple Excel spreadsheet that calculates the cost per head to run your household.
For us it is pretty easy. My Skid visits his BioDad for 5 wks in the summer. It is easy to see the difference in utilities, food, gas, and entertainment costs while his is gone.
That said, if you take 1/3 of the mortgage cost and the difference between all other costs when he is home and when he is with BioDad our estimate for one kid (16) is $800/mo (housing, utilities, food, gas, entertainment/extracurricular activities).
If you pull the housing costs out completely it drops to $500/mo since we have more bedrooms that people which is his Mom's and my choice. A hundred or two a month is probably a fair estimate of housing costs for most kids.
This does not count costs for clothing, medical, dental, hair cuts,car insurance, etc ..... If you SWAG these things you are probably talking nearly $1000/mo in the location and lifestyle we live.
The USDA calculates the cost of raising a child to age 18 to be between $119,000 and $250,000 depending on your household income. Income ranges used by the USDA range from up to $39,000 per year and greater than $66,000 per year.
Using the USDA calculations the monthly cost to raise a child ranges from ~$550 to ~$1160 per month depending on family income level.
Here is the link to the USDA data site on MSN.
http://moneycentral.msn.com/articles/family/kids/tlkidscost.asp
If you add in the cost of supporting them through and paying for college you are talking $350K plus.
Expensive little vampires aren't they?
Now get to work on those second, third and fourth jobs. I am floating my resume now!
Best regards,
USDA is an estimate of cost to raise a child not a basis for CS.
Also, I believe that CS should not cover 100% of the cost. Ideally CS should only be 50% of the cost since both parents should be contributing equitably to the cost of raising the child.
Of course there are living expenses that an adult must cover for themselves that are only marginally increased with the addition of a child. Housing, insurance costs (HO, med, car, life), and other basics. However, it can be logically assumed that many will provide a quality of goods and services for the child that is commiserate with income. If you make more you spend more. Better school districts, more expensive foods, restaurants, newer and safer automobiles, Ralph Lauren instead of Walmart, Jose' hair cuts instead of SuperCuts, Lancome makeup instead of Max Factor, etc ...... It is not mandatory that more is spent to raise a child in a higher income household than a lower one but it is likely.
This is why the USDA tables have an income component factored in.
Certainly a child can be raised on far less than $1000/mo regardless of income levels available. However, just about every cost has at least a slight increase when there is a child to raise and some costs have a significant increase.
I may have misinterpreted the premise of the original post. I thought the general question was how to document the costs to raise a child in order to show BM why she should be paying her CS. If you are going to do that then give her the full meal deal cost estimate to show her that the CS she is obligated to pay does not come close to covering the costs.
Also keep in mind that the monthly costs to raise a kid are not linear. As the child gets older the costs go up. The $550 - $1100 are linearized estimates. The charts actually have progressively higher yearly costs by age range of the kid.
Best regards,
CS should not be used to expand the CP's lifestyle.
Dany,
Of course the BM in your situation is benefiting financially by having custody. Ideally the CS provided by your DH should not be used to raise the BM's other two children. Since there is no accountability for where the CS money goes, BM can use it as she wishes. That is a major problem with the system IMHO.
If your friend loses her house because her 19yo moves out and the CS goes with him then she was using CS to improve her own lifestyle and not for the kid. Loss of her house associated with loss of CS is indicative of poor judgement on her part. If she could not afford the house on her own income and needed CS to pay for it she should have opted for a home more commensurate with her income. Why should her adult child (19)feel the guilt of having to stay with her so she does not lose her house because of her poor financial judgement. IMHO of course.
Personally I have no problem with kids living with either parent. They should be with the parent most capable of parenting and that makes the kid the priority rather than a parent that considers the kid as an income source. That said, CS is critical not only as a financial resource for providing for the child but so that the child knows that the NCP is participating in providing for the child.
Keep in mind that I am married to the CP who receives CS. And I agree that many NCPs get screwed in the CS process and many CPs use CS to enhance their own lifestyles rather than applying the money where it should be spent which is on the kid. In our case CS currently adds up to ~$4320.00/yr (the first 8yrs it was ~$1560/yr)which is disgustingly low IMHO and is entirely irrelevent to our financial situation. The money means absolutely nothing to us and never has but my wife and I refuse to waive BioDad's CS obligation because my Son (SS) will never have to hear that his Dad did not love him enough to pay CS. That is the only reason why I care about CS in our case. I would spend 5X the amount we receive in CS on a lawyer just to keep BioDad on the hook and so that he never forgets that he has responsibilities towards my SS.
Vindictive of me I know, but my kid will always be able to fall back on the belief that his BioDad cared enough to support him. Even though by his actions BioDad could not give a flying rat's ass about my SS.
You are absolutely correct about teenage boys eating a lot. My SS-16 eats like an elephant. When he is with us our food bill goes up by ~65%. :jawdrop:
All just my thoughts of course.
Best regards,
No question that most CS levels are excessive.
Dany,
I absolutely agree with your statement.
However, there are so many ancillary and hidden costs to raising a child that are virtually impossible to specifically identify that there is a significant fudge factor included in most state CS calculators.
Regardless of CS levels set by the courts I believe there should be some accountability or limitations on how the money is spent by the CP.
And I am married to the CP that receives CS.
Best regards,
Just to clarify
My point in wanting to determine how much it costs to support SD is that I think it would be nice for BM to see how the child support is being used to support her daughter. Again, that is when, or if, she ever pays it.
I just got inspired by the other posts about child support and how there is no accountability.
I do appreciate your comment Rags, you are probably right in that it would be too much info and could come back to bite us. When it comes to BM, no good deed goes unpunished.
Thanks for all the input though.
Two roads diverged in a yellow wood, and I---
I took the one less traveled by,
and that made all the difference. -Robert Frost-
interesting
I checked out the site RAGS suggested. BM's expenses went up about 1000 per month after FSS1 was about 9 months old - before that it was about since she did not pay daycare until he was 9 months old and her extra costs were for insurance and baby's personal expenses - cloths, diapers, he was breastfed so food was really not a factor. Anyway, BF pays $800 for CS. That is way more than half of FSS1's actual costs for "raising" him. BM all ready had 2 mortgages, car insurance, personal expenses, utilities, etc. BUT now BM has all those things plus the expenses of rent to live with her BF and the expenses that go along with having a second residence. If FSS1 lived with us, our monthly expenses would go up may 500 a month for daycare, insurance and such and BF would not pay CS. BF doesn't want CS from BM if he was to ever get custody. Strangly enough, according to the CS calculator if BF got custody BM would pay considerably less CS to BF and she makes quite a bit more money. That's just nuts!