Update on the Heart Ache

We had planned to take a day trip on Wednesday to a lake that SO had a cabin on growing up, with the ski boat and jetskis. SK's have been wanting to go there for a while. Well when SS18 told SO that he wasn't going to be going on the Colorado trip, SO lost all interest in the trip. He didn't know how he could sit in a boat with him and stare at him all day while he was clearly hurt and angry. Tuesday night SO said two words ("hi" and "yeah") to SS18. SS18 knew something was different. SO told SK's that he had no desire to go out the next day and we could all just sit in the muggy house and do some housework instead. Wednesday morning, SO woke up at 6:30 and headed out to do yard work (I swear he mowed the whole yard 3 times just so he didn't have to talk to SS18.) At about 1pm SO, SS18, and I were in the garage looking at the dirt bike SO just picked up for the trip. All of a sudden SO went off. He is not a yeller, so it was all so calm, yet awkward enough for me to want to book it out of there. Sitting outside I still heard the whole speach. It was very heart felt and SO even started to cry half way through. It was very emotional. SS18 barely said anything. (he did tell SO that he tried to be able to come. That he yelled and yelled at BM but it didn't work) Then SO said "just think about all of that" and walked out of the garage. SD16 heard the whole thing too. She turned to me and says "he's never been mad at us before!" That is when I realized that some of the problem is that SS18 like the path of least resistance and BM is all resistance and SO is has very little resistance. This is the first sign of resistance they have really seen. So then we started another project and about 2 hours later SO asked SS18 if he had thought about what he said at all. SS18 said "yeah, I think I am going to go." SO had made it clear that it wasn't this specific trip that he cared about. It was the right and the wrong behind it. Anyways, it sounds like SS18 is going. This morning he text and said "if there is still a seat in the truck for the trip, I will take it."

It is so weird that they always stick up for BM. In this case, both SK's at different times were like "well, I see her point too, I mean it will so close to him leaving for college and she will miss him. Its like one of her last couple weeks of seeing him before he leaves"

UMMMM isn't it your dads last chance too? Either of them could drive out there if they want. That is your moms choice not to if she doesn't. Not to mention they will be gone for 5 days. Wed-Sun. BM Has a week at a time on either side of his days when it isn't his weekend. So every other week, BM gets 6 days in a row with them. For the last 9 years...

All SO wanted was SK's to see that he gets hurt too. They feel bad for hurting BM but must not realize that SO hurts too!!!

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Maybe I'm missing something

Maybe I'm missing something or part of some back story, but didn't your DH just in essence do exactly what BM did?? I feel bad for your SS.. seems as though no matter what he does, someone is going to be pissed off. :?

Can you explain? Trying to

Can you explain? Trying to see what you are saying but I really don't see it.

Just that BM plays games with

Just that BM plays games with skids...guilts them into feeling sorry for her etc. Yet, that is pretty much what your DH just did. Didn't speak to SS for a day then told SS he made him feel bad etc. So SS tells your DH that he is not going on trip to make BM happy, then DH gets upset, so now he's going on trip to make DH happy... see what I mean by the guy can't win?

And maybe he just didn't want to go on the trip? I mean he's 18, starting college, maybe he wanted to spend time with friends or whatever. I just feel bad for the guy like he's trying to please everyone but himself.

He will never "win" in life,

He will never "win" in life, if he makes choices based on hurting someones feelings. A big part of the conversation that they had. He is an adult now. He needs to be able to make choices in his life. He should have never kept planning all these trips if he didn't want to go. There is no excuse if he didn't want to go, he needs to say that. He is an adult now, he can be responsible for his own choices. The whole point to the talk he had with him was to get him to please himself and not everyone else. It was really only 15 minutes on Tuesday night that he saw him and that he intentionally didn't speak to him even though they were in the same room. Wednesday, he was on the tractor and the lawn mower until right before he had the big heart to heart. I feel bad for SO. I feel bad that his kids can't even see how much their decisions affect him. I feel bad that he even had to get a little resistant in order to teach his son a value he needs in order to carry on a normal life. I feel bad that SS18 is in this spot, but he chooses to be. All it would take is a couple times standing up to BM and things would start to turn around. SO can't just go through life being their friend. He needs to teach them to stand up to bullies. He need them to know that they are very capable of having a mind of their own and fighting for what they truly want. He waited 9 years to put his son in this spot. Now is the time for SS18 to step up.

So your husband acts like a

So your husband acts like a spoiled 10 year old in order to teach his son the importance of behaving like an adult? :? :?

There's no excusing BM for the role she has played in all of this, but your husband is just as wrong as she is.

How so?

It's kind of hard to teach an

It's kind of hard to teach an old dog new tricks... it's the same as those of us with craptastic skids who are turning 18 with no life skills and no clue... there is no fairy that comes on the eve of one's 18th birthday and sprinkles pixie dust and shazaam! these kids who have been TAUGHT no different are suddenly supposed to fend for themselves in an adult manner?

I agree with the others below, your DH taught your SS that he should give into BM demands to keep the peace, by his own actions (or inactions)

Which actions were those? The

Which actions were those? The divorce?

I see your point EXACTLY! We

I see your point EXACTLY! We have the same situation. Skids are always erring on th side of BM. They have ZERO respect for SOs feelings and basically tell him as much.

We have had this exact situation over and over again with skids. For instance Easter. It was SOs year on top of the fact that she hasn't wanted them on Easter ever. Dinner with family the same time every year. BM doesn't speak to her family (they are normal she doesn't like that) so she has zero plans on holidays. Anyway he offered for her to take skids for a couple hours in the morning (which has happened before). BM picks skids up and as soon as they pull away she texts that they will not be back until hours after dinner time with his family because she has decided she is cooking dinner this year. He responds with the time they initially agreed on and she texts back oh well send the police for them (she knows he will not put his kids in that position). Anyway SO was livid the entire day and what happens when the time comes around he was originally supposed to get them...he texts I am on my way. She reminds him to send police. And the SKIDS begin to call screaming at him to stop bullying their mom! Yup there you have it folks...same bullshit just different family.

It's sad and I hope your SS really means what he says. He has aged out and his BM no longer has authority over his whereabouts. Hope he sticks with it.

Thank you. Me too. I hate

Thank you. Me too. I hate that he is in the spot he is in, but there really is no way around it. Some seem to think there is... but I don't see any other way. The vicious circle is more likely to repeat with him if he doesn't have the eye opener before he has kids himself.

That is a terrible story. If

That is a terrible story. If I was your DH that would be the last time BM got that sort of consideration.

I see your point EXACTLY! We

I see your point EXACTLY! We have the same situation. Skids are always erring on th side of BM. They have ZERO respect for SOs feelings and basically tell him as much.

It's sad and I hope your SS really means what he says. He has aged out and his BM no longer has authority over his whereabouts. Hope he sticks with it.

How was SO supposed to stick

How was SO supposed to stick up to BM?? How did he not?? Sorry just don't see what you mean here.

SO was court ordered to not

SO was court ordered to not have any face to face contact with her. Which I agree is sad. I agree that their relationship isn't ideal for the kids, but it is out of his control at this point. Wish I would have had time to start at the beginning for some back story. He wasn't trying to guilt him. He just needed him to see both sides of the story and to know that every action has a consequence or a reaction. SS18 talked for the last year about all these awesome trips they were going to take as soon as he turned 18 but hasn't been able to get out of the death grip his mom has on him. Why tell SO about all the week long trips they will go on, if you can't fallow through. There is never a good time to be at odds and have to tell your dear children that the world isn't roses and rainbows. It's never fun. Bus someone has to do it. Someone had to wake SS18 up and show him that everyone has feelings. He told him this trip matters none. We knew that if SS18 didn't make it obvious right away when he was 18 that he ultimately has a say in what he wants to do with his own time/life, that the longer he waited the harder it would be. BM thinks that it means nothing, and maybe you do to... but in reality it means a lot. It means that the court order that was established 9 years ago, is no longer in effect for SS18. It means that all those times that SO got screwed out of time or experiences can come to an end. For anyone that got screwed as bad as he did, this is the light at the end of the tunnel. He in no way wanted to guilt him. He just wanted him to see that SO isn't made of stone, and that SO can be just as hurt and dissapointed as BM. He just chose not to use it to control SK's their whole child hood.

HOW? If they had a court

HOW?

If they had a court order in place, he could have forced her to stick to it. If she refused to hand the kid over, call the police have them file a report. Take the report to court and file contempt against BM. Do that each time and sooner or later she would have gotten the message that he wasn't playing with her behind.

It would have also taught his son that you don't roll over and allow people to walk all over you.

Your husband has been an adult a lot longer to his son. It's absolutely ridiculous that he expects this kid to do something in a few months that he hasn't been able to do in YEARS.

Both parents are at fault here. Mom and dad are two peas in a pod. They are both using guilt(emotional abuse????)to get the kid to do what they want him to do. Clearly he doesn't want to hurt either one of them.

What do you mean by forced

What do you mean by forced her to stick to it? She never refused to hand over the kid against the court order. (Although in the court order it did say that SO could pick kids up early on any day that was his as long as they didn't have plans. Everytime he would text and say he would be picking them up, she would call them with chores that had to be done first to prevent that) He can't do anything other than what the court allows. This has nothing to do with SO standing up to BM. Fill me in here.

Again, I don't see where it

Again, I don't see where it says he let BM get away with anything. Court order was fallowed to a T. He never pretended everything was ok. They got to hear all the pain and grief he was put through. He just never put it on the kids to stand up to it. Now that his son is 18, he put it out there. He never once made them feel like he could care less. I can't see where you are pulling this from. Someone please help???

He could never be mad at them

He could never be mad at them before because a court order is a court order. Anything to do with his time with them was pre determined. Now he can get mad at SS18 if he wants because it is no longer decided for SS18 but by SS18. For the last year, SS18 has walked on egg shells as to not upset BM. He wanted to work with SO (we own a business) but everytime he was scheduled his mom would come up with a reason he couldn't work and he couldn't stand up to her. SO SS18 would then decide when he was working the morning of so that BM couldn't interfere. Anything to avoid conflict. Anything that does or does not happen now that SS18 is "emancipated" is directly his decision (other than the fact that he cannot stand up to BM)

I think your DH needed to say

I think your DH needed to say that to SS. These BMs make out that they're so HURT when skids LEAVE THEM to spend time with their fathers. It's time someone stood up and told them how the dad feels when that happens!

There's nothing wrong with

There's nothing wrong with your SO telling his son how he feels but the way he was treating him before the talk was not right.

These kids turning 18 means nothing. If they still depend on BM financially or emotionally, or have been raised to please her or else be treated badly, they remain under her thumb.

My SD is 25 and is still very dependent on BM, she does not want to piss her off. BM is passive aggressive and manipulative, and can make SD feel like crap at the drop of a hat.

My DH tells her to stand up to BM but he wants her to do it for HER sake, not for his. He wants her to be able to stand on her own two feet and not have to put up with BM's emotional manipulation and the hurt that comes with it.

It's a struggle for these kids to stand up for themselves, after a lifetime of knuckling under. It will take time, strength, and support. Your SS going away to college will probably help tremendously. But it won't happen overnight.

Add me to the posters who

Add me to the posters who agree your DH did the right thing by expressing his feelings. Yes, he could have been a little more mature by not ignoring SS for a few days before, but It sounds like it was taking him awhile to work through his feelings. Dads are just people too, sometimes they mess up, sometimes they get emotional, and sometimes they get hurt. He did the right thing by talking it through with them at the end.

We have a similar dynamic. Our counselor has basically told us that the kids will try to protect their BM over DH because she's the fragile one. She said that over time they will see how incompetent she is, and her manipulations, but they will always love her. That love will be tinged with pity though. What DH has a chance at is a full adult relationship based on mutual respect and love that BM will not be able to achieve as she is so childlike and dependent on them.

Also, in our case, my SD

Also, in our case, my SD knows that her dad loves her unconditionally. BM, not so much. She is much more concerned about pleasing BM than DH because of that.

If SS18 were still on the

If SS18 were still on the court ordered parenting time, it would not be SO's time with him. If that were the case, BM WILL NOT EVER SWITCH. No matter what which is annoying. Anyways, SS18 is no longer on that court order, so there shouldn't even be an issue if he would like to go do something with his DAD for 5 days. SS18 is too scared to hurt BM's feelings to tell her he would rather go do something with his dad. It's sad.

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Update on the Heart Ache

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