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SS13 and my dog

DarkStar's picture

Oh boy, steppers.  I'm at a complete loss and need your wisdom.
SS13 is autistic.  We hired a nanny for the summer to watch him.  SD15 is also home, but she has no authority over her little brother, he doesn't listen to her at all.  It's also not fair for her to give up her summer to babysit her little brother.

This latest incident with my dog just started this week.  My puppers is a 50 pound boxer/terrier/hound mix.  She is a sweetie.  She LOOOOOOOOVES people.  Other dogs?  Not so much.  When we go to dog park, she loves up on all of the people and pretty much ignores the dogs.  My FDH has a 50 pound puggle.  The 2 dogs have been around each other for several years and get along fine.

My SS has always teased the animals.  I have a 15 year old cat also.  He pokes them, pulls tails, ruffles fur the wrong way, scares them from behind, puts his face in theirs, pretty much everything you're NOT supposed to do to animals.  

We have told him to stop, separated him from the animals, and punished when he disobeys.
Things came to a head on Sunday evening.  My dog has growled a couple of times at SS when he approaches her.  This time he stuck his hand out at her and she nipped him.  All hell breaks loose.  No skin is broken.  FDH and I have one of the worst arguments ever, basically "my kid" vs "your dog".  
As of this morning, SS did it again.  Again a little nip. I WARNED FDH of this MONTHS ago....I said this is GOING to happen and what are we going to do about it?  Apparently just watch them and keep them apart....which ISN'T working since SS ignored the nanny's instructions and approached my dog this morning.  FDH also thinks that if my dog does end up biting and causes harm, that we will have to get rid of her.
HOLD THE PHONE HERE....this is NOT an aggressive dog, this is NOT a dog problem, this is a YOUR KID problem.  And over my dead body will my dog be made to leave the house.  This did not go over well with FDH.  When dogs are continously bothered, they get frustrated.  Nipping is how they express their frustration.  It's animal behavior for crying out loud, but FDH expects MY dog to just "leave him alone".  "If he bothers her, why doesn't the dog just avoid SS?"

Seriously?????  Why doesn't SS leave HER alone???  

Punishment for today was 10 minutes in the corner, 100 sentences "I will not bother the dog....etc", no screens, toys or games at all today, quiet reading or drawing is OK.  No using his microscope the rest of the week.  Also BM is on board, if he does it again, he will lose swimming privileges when he is with her (week on/week off in the summer).

This isn't going to stop.  I'm traveling for work this week and FREAKING OUT that I can't be with my beloved furbaby to protect her from SS.  I have no kids of my own.  My pets are my kids.  Period.End.Dot.

NOW WHAT??????  FDH has made some many not-so-helpful comments such as:  "You have zero regard for the fact that I can't control SS and his behaviors because his brain isn't right.  You expect me to do more than I am."
Well, I DO expect you to do more!!!  What you are doing now is not working and his behavior is ESCALATING!!!

And please, none of the "leave him" crap.  We JUST moved in together in January, been together 8 YEARS working on this stuff.

I'm at a loss what to do.

Comments

Disneyfan's picture

At the point, the dog and the boy can't live in the same home.  The boy will continue to aggravate the dog and the dog will continue to do what dogs do.

If moving out  (not ending the relationship, just living separately)isn't an option, then one of them has to go.  The kid isn't going anywhere.

Pear's picture

Imagine for a moment that SS is 3 years old.  He could not be expected to never bother the dog.  As adults, you would be responsible for making sure the dog and child are never unsupervised and even under supervision if they are close to one another, you must be right there next to them.

 

i have no idea about your Ss’s abilities, but It sounds like he has problems with impulse control.  As adults, you must be sure he is never near this dog.  If the dog does more than nip him you may face serious moral and legal consequences.  The dog may also face serious consequences.  

This situation can’t continue.  You either need a solid plan to keep them separated or the dog needs to live elsewhere.

Aniki-Moderator's picture

Board your dog while you're gone.

When you come home, you need to make a decision. Are you willing to give up your furbaby? If she bites SS, there is a risk she will be put down.

  1. Build a separate area for her to which SS has absolutely NO access. And I do mean NO access. None, zilch, zero, nada. As fas as SS is concerned, your furbaby has disappeared.
  2. Find her a home.
  3. Find a home for you and your furbaby and continue to date your FDH.

{{{HUGS}}}

Aunt Agatha's picture

Board your dog while you are away!  It will prevent anything horrible happening while you are away.

 

I get it.  I don’t have kids, and my dogs, cats and chickens are so important to me.  I would move out rather than risk any of my pets taking action against an out of control kid.

This kid isn’t going away.  If something happens to your dog (kid or DH seriously hurts the poor thing?  Gives the dog away while you are away?), that could end your marriage too.

I hope only the best for you and your pup!

marblefawn's picture

This has disaster written all over it. I feel sorry for your poor dog. But if something happens, the dog will pay, not the dad or the kid.

Your dog is telling you she's about had it with the kid. She may never do more than nip, and eventually nipping might teach the kid about teasing animals. But you don't know she won't rip his face off, so you better do something fairly drastic now.

How would you feel about muzzling the dog? It sucks, but the options are not great since society frowns on muzzling kids for whatever reason.

Is the house so small that the kid and dog are always near one another? Maybe it's time to look for new accommodations. 

Is the nanny mindful that the kid MUST NOT be near the dog? The nanny needs to step it up -- if the dog is inside, the kid is outside. If the dog is in the room, she takes the kid to another room. Maybe the nanny could take the kid to a day program somewhere so there's time for the dog to rela without this harassing kid. The rest of the time, the dog might have to be locked away because, again, society frowns on locking kids away.

Your BF is right -- he can't control this kid's behavior. What do you expect him to do with the kid who is punished but doesn't learn? Even BM is on board and you still can't keep this from happening!

I'd hate to see this turn out bad for your dog. I know you JUST moved in, but maybe this isn't the time to live together. It's no one's fault -- you didn't foresee this issue with his kid. If the kid were normal and allergic to the dog, you'd be in the same boat.

If you want to safely keep your dog without drastically altering her daily life with a muzzle or being shut away in another room, maybe reconsider living together for now. Sadly, our dogs don't last long. You could try it again in the future when you don't have your girl.

There is one more option, now that I think about it. You could talk to a dog trainer. It will cost a bundle to get one who really knows their stuff, and there's still no guarantee the worst won't happen. But it could give you some pointers on how to address your dog's needs so she's less likely to be scared and bite out of fear. Maybe you could train the dog not to fear the annoying kid or, as your BF said, to get up and walk away from the little gnat. I've never heard of that sort of training before, but maybe it's out there. Maybe take your dog through a service animal course, which teaches them to not fear situations that dogs typically fear. Maybe even try to get the dog to respect the kid and vice versa (I don't hold out much hope for humans, though.) If the kid is able to be trained at all, maybe letting him take the dog through the service course would teach them both (or at least the dog) that the kid is an authority figure to her so she will be less likely to bite. I don't know if SS is capable of that, but it's a thought.

The thing is, your dog probably wouldn't be a candidate for service because she fear bites. But that doesn't mean that the training wouldn't ease the situation and teach the dog that the kid is to be obeyed. Yea, I know, it's like letting the patients run the asylum...but you just need to fix this so it's good for your dog. If it means the kid takes on an authority role to the dog, it's better than the alternative.

 

Harry's picture

DH has to control his son.  Auttistic is not a excuse for this kid actions, it’s your DH job to take care of his kid and not let him run a mock 

marblefawn's picture

Really?

People are here trying to give you advice and you're calling them out for spelling and typos? Nice.

TexasPickles's picture

Dog v. Kid.... kid wins. 

I would not want to give up my dog, but since you don't want to leave I like the idea of building a separate area where allpets can escape. Forget an alarm that sounds off,  SS will find a way around the alarm. Make SO pay for it all, since his kid is the reason for construction.

Really though, it might be best to find your dog a new home. As it stands the poor thing is being set up for disaster. Good luck!

DarkStar's picture

They have to be kept apart.  Period.  When kids are in school and we are both at work, furbaby is in our room.  She's content there.  I didn't think it was "fair" for furbaby to have to be put away, but it's what she does 3/4 of the year, so she'll be OK.

notsurehowtodeal's picture

She has been telling you in an escalating fashion that SS is annoying her. She started with trying to avoid him, moved on to growling and is now nipping. This is not going to stop, and I don't think any amount of training (of the dog) is going to help. She is going to move on to actually biting and breaking the skin sooner or later. A dog can do a great deal of damage and it is not pretty.

If SS gets bitten and needs medical care, animal control is going to become involved. Even if she is up on her shots, she will be quarantined in some way - at home or in a kennel for 10 days. You might be issued a ticket for "vicious" or "dangerous" dog. It is doubtful she would be seized or put down for a first offense, but it is possible. BM sounds cool about it now, but she could change her tune if there is blood.

The dog needs to be separated from the kid on a permanent basis.

Kennel her inside w/a locking door and only let her out when kid is gone or you are there or put her in the garage (with the door locked) instead of the kennel. Maybe a doggie door to an outside kennel.

Put her in a bedroom w/a lock that needs a key. Do you have a room you could put her in and then add a dog door and a fenced kennel outside?

I'd keep at least the cat, if not the other dog, away from him too. I would also worry that SS may at some point move from "teasing" to "hurting." This is not fair to your dog and you need to do what it takes to make sure it never happens again.

Merry's picture

Tough situation. I would board him while you're gone so that you're not worrying about this.

I can't provide any better ideas than others have. But keeping them enitrely separated IS possible. This isn't the same situation at all, but the logistics might be similar. When DH and I moved in together, he had two dogs and I had two dogs, and then my daughter moved back in temporarily with one more dog. One of my dogs and one of his dogs did NOT get along -- all the others were fine in any combination of the pack. We had to keep the two dogs separate. Lots of inside and outside gyrations,but we got it into a habit and it was completely workable.  

 

thinkthrice's picture

In my day, my parents would say "see what you get for annoying the dog/cat?"  Would not show any sympathy for us.  I'm sorry I don't but into this stuff that every other kid is "autistic" or "spectrum" or "ODD."  He should have been spanked or have HIS hair tugged on to see how it feels and perhaps develop an iota of empathy.  This sounds like a selfish feral who had never been parented or told "NO!" with immediate consequences. 

My skids were animal torturers and would pull fur, tails, shove and kick my furbabies.  In fact, SD shot my older cat in the backside with a BB gun--and yeah they are supposedly learning disabled.   If they were my bios, I would have corrected it in toddlerhood by tanning their hides.

DarkStar's picture

I agree that "autistic" is a label that is misued and overused. 

HOWEVER........this kid has a messed up brain.  It is not a speshul snowflake poor COD situation.  This kid is really, truly DAMAGED.  He has a permanent IEP at school, he is waiting for approval for SSI so he can get services when he is 18.  It doesn't take much time to be around this kid to see that he has issues that are BEYOND poor parenting.  FDH has had full custody of skids for over 5 years.  He has disciplined and "tanned his hide" PLENTY of times.  The kid is just MISSING something.  He doesn't get it, he doesn't understand, he doesn't feel remorse except feeling badly for himself that he is in trouble.

Case in point with puppers.  FDH piled on more punishment tonight when he got home.  SS is crying, hollering that it isn't fair, we are all mean, PUPPERS is mean, and no one UNDERSTANDS.  This isn't kid deflection, he really doesn't understand, he doesn't get it, he can't see or react beyond his own immediate gratification with almost NO impulse control.  Does that give him a pass on his behavior?  Hell, no, he IS given consequences for it each and every time.

So, TT, you can truly stick that narrow-minded opinion in a deep, dark hole.  YOUR skids are beyond the pale of poor parenting.  Project much?  BM is more of the absent parent, FDH has parenting faults, but he is there and present and has been a PARENT in action. Sheesh

justmakingthebest's picture

My SS is 18 but is at the cognitive age of 11-12. Sure he can do some things, but there is a lot that is really hard for him. I have to treat him on the same level as my 10/12 yr old bios. He is a boy trapped in a grown body. I don't know where your SS is, but that might be something to find out. He is 13 but might be cognitively 7. Not saying that a 7 yr old shouldn't know better BUT a 7 yr old with bad/little/nonexistent impulse control -- yeah... not so good.

I am with the others who suggested having a place that SS is not allowed. Ideally there is a room that can be closed off with access to a doggy door and your sweet pup can go in and out as he pleases and SS can't get to him. If you don't have that already, maybe you can install a doggy door in a room that SS can be locked out of. Because at the end of the day, even if it ends your relationship, if the pup draws blood or causes stitches on SS- I bet both BM and SO demand he be put down. Time to keep the pup safe from the kid. 

momjeans's picture

So, if I’m reading this correctly, SS terrorizes the puggle as well? Surely he must be, or he’s making a conscious decision to only terrorize the animals you brought into the relationship. How is that working out for the puggle? 

I don’t know. This dog is your “child.” I’d be struggling with my FDH’s comments so much that it would have me questioning a lot of other things, too. 

In the meantime, I’d board my dog while out of town. It’s not worth the risk, and this poor dog is being set-up to fail. With potential serious consequences, sadly. 

I have a 3 and a 4 year old - and a 1 year old cat that freaking loves them. I’ve put the fear in my children to show nothing but kindess and love to her, though, because she’s so tolerant of their fast moving and loud ways. I just cannot imagine having to possibly  get rid of a pet. I’m sorry you’re dealing with this. 

DarkStar's picture

For your wise and experienced comments. 

I called FDH tonite and basically told him....as much as I think it's SS who deserves to be kenneled or shock-collared.......puppers needs to be kept in our room during the day and you're right, kid trumps dog, but it's up to US to prevent that from happening.  He was a little surprised that I had "backed down" so to speak.  The nanny will keep puppers in our room, she lets them out once in a while for potty breaks.  FDH and I will be responsible for keeping them apart.  I really hope FDH keeps to that....one of the nipping incidents happened while everyone was in the same room (except me)!  "keeping an eye out" my foot!  Time will tell. 

Interesting that SS is tormenting MY dog the most.  He treats all of the animals in the same annoying, inappropriate way, but now he is uber focused on my puppers.  Of course, FDH says he does the same to pudgy puggle, but SHE is more patient.  Massive eye roll there.  I would bet the farm that pudgy puggle HAS nipped before and either FDH didn't see it or "doesn't remember"

I told FDH that it really sucks having to be on guard in our own home so much.  Where is SS???  What is he doing???  All.Day.Every.Day.  But puppers follows me like the Pied Piper so I don''t think keeping her away from SS when I'm home will be an issue.

FDH asked BM if SS tormented their dogs.  She said he would run after them to try to pet them, but they always ran away.  They have Shar Peis.  I asked if BM had an opinion about what was going on with puppers and SS and he snorted and said, "She said, if it was her, she would beat SS's ass."  OMG I about choked!!!!  I gotta throw some props to BM for that one.  I said, "Maybe she's not so bad after all."  HA!!!!  FDH was not amused.

notsurehowtodeal's picture

I would still put a lock on the door and give the key to the Nanny so she can wear it around her neck. Or install a lock with a code.

Areyou's picture

In this case I would have to give the kid some leeway. I wouldn’t like how he treats my dog either but if he doesn’t have the ability to understand social cues then there’s not much you can do.

EvenStarsFall's picture

Has anyone sat down and talked about how animals should be treated?  I'm no expert for children with austism and obviously don't know anything about your SS, but maybe get him a stuffed animal-like a FurReal pet-and show him how to actually pet them and treat them nicely and he would be able to take care of it.  Or maybe you could possibly find a video or a book that might explain it a little better.   I see he is being punished for treating her badly, but maybe he doesnt understand how he should be treating them.   Is there a way to work out a reward system if he leaves the dog alone? Like if you have the dog out for small increments of time and then gradually increase it. 

DarkStar's picture

I really don't want to use my dog as his training example.  Her behavior is telling me that she has HAD IT with SS, so I just need to keep them apart.  I do like the idea of a FurReal pet or some YouTube videos about how to treat animals.

He KNOWS what he is and is not supposed to do, he just can't/won't put his impulses in check.  Zero impulse control.  Thinks in the MOMENT of what he wants right now, no forethought for the consequences after.

EvenStarsFall's picture

I didn't mean to use your dog as a training example--the reward idea was for later on if he starts understanding and that was basically if he leaves your dog alone.  Its a tough situation, I was just trying to offer some ideas that weren't to get rid of your dog or move out. 

WarMachine13's picture

I sure don't get the "get rid of your fur babies". When I adopt a dog/cat, it's for the life of that dog/cat. Do you shuffle your kids off when they get pissy and growl?? Jeesh.

DarkStar's picture

I get that "kid trumps dog" but there is no WAY I'd get rid of my dog.  I do not plan on letting it get to the point where I have to make that decision.  Being out of town for work this week has my anxiety at PEAK levels worrying about my puppers. 

When I get home, I have no problem keeping SS away from puppers.  Physically if need be.

ESMOD's picture

As a few others have suggested, boarding your dog while you are on this trip will remove the immediate worry while you are not there.  Then, when you are home, put the 100% foolproof solution in place.  Whether it is that the dog stays in one room unless you are there personally to supervise or take it for a walk.. or whether there is some other option.... when you aren't there to ensure that others do the right thing.. remove the dog from the home.  Doggie Daycare if need be.  Yes it costs money but if you want to keep the dog you really are left with little other choice because the kid can't change and can't leave.