What does "when school is dismissed" mean to you?
Forums:
UGH! our BM has the EOW visitation and 1 night a week that begins "at the time school is dismissed" But she interprets this to mean whenever she friggin feels like taking SD out of school. Our BM thinks that no matter what, since she is mom she can just head on up there and check SD out 30 mins, an hour, 2 hours before. Without even letting DH (BD) know or ask first. We finally had to write a note refrencing the order that was alrady on file at the school that school time is dad's time and he must give permission for SD to leave early. A doctor's appt or being sick is one thing, but just because you feel like getting her early is not OK. AHH!
I posted on your blog also. I
I posted on your blog also. I don't see how this can be confused with anything else OTHER THAN WHEN SCHOOL IS DISMISSED. School is not dismissed if she has to go into the office and sign the child out while other children are still in class. There is nothing to be confused about.
dup
dup
I would have a serious
I would have a serious problem with my kid being pulled out of school for no damn reason. They need to be there.
Agree- which is why we had to
Agree- which is why we had to resort to the dang office lady having to call DH to verify or not. Even after DH repeatedly letting BM know he didn't want her out early she kept doing it, trying to be sneaky about it. So annoying. and of course if it was the other way around you know BM would be calling the cops on DH saying he kidnapped her. BM's get way too much leeway with stuff.
BUT since it is BM if we took
BUT since it is BM if we took it to court, say we had 10-20 instances with school records to prove it as well as nice e-mails letting her know he didn't agree, blah blah,.... guess who looks like a nit-picker? BD in the messed up BM takes all court system we have here. ONLY reason BD dad is primary is because BM was off partying and getting knocked up during the divorce and didn't give a rats a$$ at that time.
BM in our case has pulled
BM in our case has pulled skid out for haircuts,fishing and other crazy stuff. If BM has day off from work she will let kids skip school so they can spend "fun" time together ...... Crazy
I must preface this by saying
I must preface this by saying I homeschool my kids....the court says that the time begins when school is dismissed, but the checking the kid out is a totally different matter. Does this mean that the ncp can't go check the child out for lunch and bring him/her back? Because technically that is the "Dad's" time. To me, if the child is in school, either parent should have access to the child as long as neither parent has been barred from visiting the child. A parent has the right to check a child out early as long as it's not interfering with child's learning (too many check outs, for instance). By saying that the NCP shouldn't be able to check a child out is saying that the school, teachers, anyone else involved, etc. is more important than the child's parent. NONE of them are. As long as this is not being abused, it should be allowed. And depending on the age of the child, it will not affect the child at all to miss even one afternoon every week of school. (I also have a teaching degree and have been a teacher...) The parent trumps the school. Every.single.time.
You don't want to see that because you probably have 10,000 gripes about the bm. That is a separate issue. Being legalistic about "Dad's time" does nothing to help the child's bond w/ bm. That time is the child's time and if the child doesn't like bm checking her out, THEN you address the issue.
On the contrary, I bet I know
On the contrary, I bet I know a little bit more than you on this topic. I have a teaching degree, WAS a teacher, worked at a school recently in a totally different state from where I grew up, and the school does NOT trump the parent. EVER. WE own our children until they are adults; the school and the government do NOT. I'm sorry that you have been brainwashed in the public school system to believe otherwise. (BTW, those "mandatory" vaccinations are also NOT required).
We are talking about a parent checking her child out of school on occasion, NOT removing her from school and neglecting her education. That's a big jump, dontcha think? If I want to check my child out from school, I don't have to tell them why. I simply can because I want to. I can take him fishing, or to get ice cream, or just because the sky is blue. There are limits when a child is enrolled in a government school, but again, we aren't talking about someone abusing it, we are talking about someone with parental rights picking her child up from school early.
The problem here is that the assumption is that some very important learning is going to be missed if the child leaves school early. Trust me, it's not. Children benefit MUCH more from feeling loved by BOTH parents than sitting in a class wasting time (which is what at least half a day at school is!)
A court order doesn't trump real life in most situations. Did you know that most normal divorced parents will exchange weekends when they need to because they have conflicts? If you follow the CO like you insist, it breeds nothing but contempt and bitterness in already touchy situations. If you have 1st/3rd/5th weekends, but need to switch for the 2nd weekend...well that's against the CO so what do you do? Normal parents work together and exchange (going both ways) whenever possible to make life easy for the kids and each other. Parents who want to be nasty and bitter for eternity will say, "tough, deal with it, you will just have to miss your weekend, because the CO says XYZ..."
It's the same situation. This is not about the mom pulling the child out every afternoon and now her grades are failing... it's about her getting the child 30 mins/1 hr/2 hrs early... it's about perspective, not using a CO to keep a parent away from his/her child.
My.kids.mom is absolutely
My.kids.mom is absolutely correct. Parents trump school every time. If the school refuses to release the child to his/her legal parent, they will be in trouble. Unless the school has a copy of a court order restricting that parents access to the child, the school cannot trump the parents right to have access to their child. A court-ordered custody plan with visitation times does not apply to the school and they cannot enforce it.
Each state has a certain amount of absences that trigger a 'truancy' but generally as long as the child attended 300 ,minutes of academic time (not lunch, gym, etc) they are considered to have been there all day. So those 30 minutes early pickups likely don't even count toward the truancy total.
If dad does not want mom to be picking up the kids early, then he needs to go to court and have the judge hold mom in contempt, and, if the judge deems it necessary, issue a restraining order to prevent mom from picking up the kids at school prior to the dismissal of all students (then the school can refuse to release the child).
As a teacher, it always amazed me how many parents just did whatever the school wanted regardless of what was best for their child. My children are used to the fact that (when they were younger) they were not allowed to access the Internet at school, they were not allowed to attend fundraising assemblies, they were not allowed to be interviewed by local media, and they were allowed to insist that I be called before speaking with any outside person (CPS, district staff, etc). I also don't answer the schools intrusive questions about where DH works, our family constellation, etc. Schools can ask for anything they want, but most of the time they do not have the legal authority to insist on the answers.
I beg to differ- there are
I beg to differ- there are court orders for a reason. Your saying bm should be able to pick up sd whenever she wants so she can bond. So dh should be able to go pick up sd during bm's time early if he wants because he wants to bond too? Nope. I think each parent should have to follow the orders as they are bc if you keep letting it slide where does it end?
That doesn't even make sense.
That doesn't even make sense. The bm isn't picking her up early from Dad's. She is checking her out of school early. This is not a big deal. Worrying about these little things is why steps get all upset over absolutely nothing. It's a big deal when it's abused and the child starts missing the same subject that is taught in the afternoon and starts doing poorly for missing it. It's not a big deal when OMG!!!!!! bm is getting more time than she's "supposed to" because some judge decided who gets what time with the kid. Again, school time is not either parent's time, it's the child's time. Legally either parent can check out a child if they have joint custody. Parents who don't like their exes and want to punish them will get legalistic with the papers and nitpick these kind of things. It just isn't worth it.
It doesn't matter who
It doesn't matter who "custodial" parent is, BOTH parents are 50/50 responsible if they have joint custody. The assumption that the NCP must be a loser and not qualified or allowed to make decisions regarding a child's education is wrong (in joint custody cases).
I also feel strongly that education is a big deal. That's why I don't send my kids to school.
Again, the school is not a
Again, the school is not a party to a court ordered parenting plan and cannot enforce it. The school staff can get in legal trouble if they refuse to release the child to their legal parent, regardless of who has primary custody, who has legal custody, etc.
The only way to give the school the power to enforce that the child is not released before the final bell is to get a restraining order that prohibits mom from picking the child up (or sending someone).
Your DH has had dealings with his judge, is this the kind of judge that is going to care about this and issue the restraining order? Or get annoyed at the nitpicking? And DH will not get in trouble with the truancy court if he can show that he gets the child to school every day but mom signs the child out consistently. In fact, if mom ends up getting dinged for truancy, then DH strengthens his position for either a restraining order and/or sole legal regarding education.
Yeas BM has some issues and
Yeas BM has some issues and it's not that DH would just say no all the time just to be a D**k. The school has a copy of the orders. They now call him when BM is requesting to pick up SD early so he knows what is going on. He says yes if there is a dr appt or it's an off day like a field trip or whatever. It's just the whole lack of care of school in the past (one year we had probably 30-40 instances of BM taking SD early that DH didnt even know about until the next year when he asked for records). We are trying to keep that lack of structure from happening again. It just amazes me that BM assumes she can take out SD whenever she wants during DH court ordered time without even running it by him first.