Sports
So I have been a reader of this website for a year or so, I haven't really had anything to post about (that yall had not already answered), this site has been super helpful so first of all thank you all for that.
So here is some background and my question:
I am married and have a 8 SD, she is great have no real issues with her, known her since she was 3. 2 years ago my husband went to court for 50/50 custody and won. He actually has full legal custody (medical, geographic choose, legal, educational exclusive rights) and him and his ex have 50/50 (one week dad, one week mom) visitation.
So in the past he has signed her up for sports and mom has not participated in any way, she refused to take SD 8 to the sports while she was with her.
So it was a little weird when a month after signing her up for softball BM texted to tell my husband she had done so. She never asked him about it, never got him to fill out medical or any other types of forms.
She then asked last night not only that he take her to practices and games on our time (which is fine, he doesn't have an issue, though this may change) but that he take her to get all her equipment for it.
Now he said nope, not doing that, that he would be happy to take her to the games but he wasn't paying as she has no contributed one dime to any of the 5 sports we have paid for, even when they had joint custody.
So the question is, does BM have the legal right to even sign her up for the sport? There are medical forms and legal forms, but he is not 100% sure, has anyone had this issue before?
How exactly? Making a decsion
How exactly? Making a decsion without the other parent then expecting the other parent to participate? Or is it that we have actual legal concerns? Or is it that that child has been in sports since she was 3 we paid for (without assuming mom would), asked permission from BM, then asked her to take the child to the sports and she refused since it would take away from her time.
Or is it because my husband who pays for everything, gets zero in child support, isn't going to pay for a sport he had no clue she was signed up for until 2 nights before the first practice?
If BM couldn't pay maybe she should have spoken to my husband in December when she signed her up. Not sure how that makes her dad an asshole, but please enlighten me.
Also just to let you know, for softball we had to suspend the cooking class she take on our saturdays that she loves, for a sport no one asked her if she wanted to play.
Somehow when you call someone
Somehow when you call someone assholes right of the gate you end up looking like one. Take a chill pill, geez.
Not complaining stating the
Not complaining stating the facts as they were. Thanks for you feedback, have you dealt with this situation before?
Always, they both always
Always, they both always signed the forms for the sports he signed her up for, even after BM lost joint custody. He always offered to pay 100% of the cost for everything and told her to take her for the weeks the BM has her, but she always flat out refuses. And we have 5 years of receipts, texts and emails to show.
Yep, until BM signed her up
Yep, until BM signed her up for something without talking to him or SD more than a month ago, told him on Sunday about it and assumed he would pay for equipment. Plus it was sports on our time, that we decided to sign her up for, with BM permission but not her support. Again you seemed to think he should just pay for whatever BM decides to do without DH input.
I'm big on sports so if my
I'm big on sports so if my child is signed up and really wants to participate I'll do whatever it takes to make it happen. From an outside viewpoint I see a mom who signed up her kid for sports (yay), Dad said she'll take her (yay) but now Dad says he's not going to get her the equipment she needs even though he's done it so for the past 5 years (er?). Does dad suddenly want to make mom buy all the equipment?
I agree that both parents should pitch in, but if DH has done it for 5 years the courts may expect him to continue to do it. Is he financially better off than BM? If he won 50/50 and got legal custody he must've had one kick a$$ lawyer which cost a pretty penny.
Your DH should be very respectful of the fact that he has legal custody because if he's an a&&, lords it over the other parent, and sd suffers because of it he WILL lose his legal rights as fast as he got them.
From my personal experience w/the courts and sports it's easier and cheaper to just pay for the equipment and save the receipts rather than make this a legal battle. In my situation exH pays CS and I pay for EVERYTHING else. I pay ALL the sports fees, for ALL the equipment, ALL the travel, hotels..etc. Yes it sucks, I wish he would pitch in more but I refuse to see my kids suffer because exH won't contribute more.
I have to agree w/above poster that the parents are being very immature in this situation. Do what's best for the kid and do what it takes to allow her to play.
Really-name calling! Most
Really-name calling!
Most sports fall under material participation responsibility vs supporting the child/. If it is mutually agreed upon then both parents Accept financial responsibility. Unless there is scholarship etc, the parent wishing for the child to be involved then they are the financial responsible party. To physically participate, both parents should have access and attempt to support the child if it is appropriate and does not infringe on the other parents' time invasively.
Olive branch buy bat, glove- Mom buys uniform etc. You buy own pictures.
Thank you, I think I badly
Thank you, I think I badly explain, its not that DH doesn't want her to participate or even that he wouldn't pay if given notice, the issue is lack of notice and now legality of the forms.
I get it. And I know how you
I get it. And I know how you feel... Much like me in many cases- it is always a "no" or "I can't" unless it benefits the Baby-Mama Ego. I would ask for nice pants or dress shoes to be sent on special occasions. We would always buy and he would outgrow in one wearing at our house. How does your kid not have a pair of good pants or shoes but every new movie or game??
I am just saying you could try this with a clear understanding that going forward don't expect that it is just " OK and Dad's gonna pay." Sometimes court just makes it all worse!!!! I've got a nightmare of a situation when I was growing up.
I struggle with both sides because I grew up being bickered over especially with money between my parents, and now I am the one making sure my SS has his needs so "Mommy Dearest" can get the wants!
Exactly! Thanks so much!
Exactly! Thanks so much!
Mom can't make dad pay for
Mom can't make dad pay for anything. Dad can't make mom ask his permission/input before signing their kid up for things.
Mom can take the kid to the doctor to have a medical form filled out. She can't schedule a surgery.
If dad decides to give mom a hard time about her taking the kid in to have the medical form completed, then yeah he is a jackass.
She cant actually do that,
She cant actually do that, the CO specifically says only emergency medical and dental services, medical forms, educational forms (even permission slips) etc have to be filled out by DH. The CO was written and approved for the specific issues brought up during the custody case.
Just an example, she was in
Just an example, she was in contempt for scheduling a doctors appointment. It was dropped because she signed a document stating she understood her (lack of really) rights for her child.
I appreciate everyone's
I appreciate everyone's responses, thank you all. You gave me a lot to think about, I disagree with some statements and apparently according to the lawyer it is illegal for her to sign her up (DH just called), so we shall see what happens from here.
You do realize that the call
You do realize that the call to the lawyer will cost as much or more than actually paying for the equipment? This kid is 8 and every little thing is going through lawyers, wow. You're in for a looong expensive ride.
They are also in for a long
They are also in for a long ride if the child in question is only 8 yo and BM expects them to pay for the activities she signs her up for without consulting with them first.
The call cost 0.00, and this
The call cost 0.00, and this is one issue we have had in over 12 months, and the only reason was because my husband was curious and wanted to see if he needed to do anything , and yes we are in for a long and expensive ride, but while I get yall think it is all on our side, if I wrote out the whole issue (it would be a long long long post) I would hope you would understand the need. Sometimes co-parenting doesn't work, sometimes a child's health and safety is worth more than your summer vacations. And in our case it absolutely was.
Unless it is in the CO that
Unless it is in the CO that both parents have to agree... I don't see how it's "illegal". TBH, I don't think that it is illegal at all for a custodial parent to sign their child up for a sport or any other activity. I think your lawyer is wrong.
Now, can she force your husband to pay for the activity or any of the equipment? Not unless it is in the CO that both parents jointly share those costs.
I guess the decision as to how much and if he will financially support his child playing ball is up to him. Can he afford it? Does he support the child playing the sport? etc...
My DH did not pay for much of anything for the cheer stuff her mother signed her up for because he was never consulted and didn't like the organization that put it on as they were not safety conscious or very organized.
He did buy both girls equipment for other sports like softball, field hockey and tennis though.
Taking them to practices etc... wasn't practical since they lived 3 hours away. So, sometimes they couldn't come for visitation due to a game.. and other times they missed games to have visitation.
The medical issue is in the
The medical issue is in the CO, the legal issue is in the CO. So I guess the simple answer is yes it is in the CO. The CO states that the NCP (mother) has no rights when it comes to any legal documents, which in Texas covers ear piercing, sports, church camp; basically anything that you have to sign a permission slip or medical release. Again is an odd thing but it was put in there for reasons made clear to the judge in the custody fight.
I think you bring up an interesting point, DH supports his daughter in anything she wants to do, but she has verbally told him twice and the BM told him once she did not want to play.She is already signed up, so he is supportive in so much that if she wants to go he will either allow her mom to take her during his time or he will take her. So he is in a tough place, BM ignored him during this whole process, she then assumed he would be paying the larger portion of the costs. The bigger issue to me (and again not my right to decide, I even try not to push my own agenda) is the lack of communication and respect she has, and as she did for the first 4 years of this kids life, ignored the rules of the CO and basically did what she wants when she wants and expects everyone to just go along with it. If that makes sense....I get a little bogged down sometimes.
Just because something is i
Just because something is i a CO, doesn't mean it is "right" or rational. Both parents should be able to have simple medical forms completed for school, summer camps or sports. Anyone who would enforcement that part of the order for something like this is on a power trip.
So DH agreed that sd could
So DH agreed that sd could play the sport and that he would take her to practices after BM signed her up. DH agreed with her *legal* decision and is technically sharing legal decision making with BM. Dh deviated from the CO and willingly shared his 100% legal decision making. Now he's throwing a fit because he's being asked to pay for equipment after he agreed with BM to put SD in the sport. Is DH now wanting to *share* everything with BM including costs and legal custody?
It will get complicated if this is taken to court. Once a parent deviates from the CO like DH did it is taken as agreement. If he yanks her from the sport now due to control and money issues he will look like a jerk in front of a judge.
Its complicated now, he
Its complicated now, he either is a jerk and pulls her out because she did it incorrectly or he supports her and then sets a pattern that it is ok. The paying for the equipment is more about her not communicating and expecting him to pay with a day notice. We have a family of our own, with costs that come before activities, if we had notice we could have given what we could, but assuming that we can just spend that amount of money in one day, annoys me.
I am truly shocked at the
I am truly shocked at the amount of people that actually expect the Dad to drop everything he is doing to round up AND pay for a sport and equipment that he knew nothing about until 2 days ago. Id say BM has some balls. Who cares if he paid before. He paid for a sport HE signed her up for and that HE talked to BM about before committing.
According to some here the BM can do whatever she wants and the Dad MUST pay for it. No Bueno!
I would not pay just on principal. BM cannot be allowed to spend the Dads money whenever she wants to. NO WAY.
Again…I am shocked that some think Dad should pony up the money because BM said to. Kid does not even want to play.
I'm with you Willow, it
I'm with you Willow, it amazes me that everyone thinks dad should pony up the funds.
Oh didn't you know your money
Oh didn't you know your money is her money too?
Here's my 2 cents, take them
Here's my 2 cents, take them or leave them. Legally BM cannot sign the forms. But if Dad agrees to the sport, no one is going to make a fuss. (It may however set a precedent that would allow BM to earn back some legal rights. Have caution depending on the reason BM is not legally allowed to make those decisions.) I have a hard time a court gave ALL legal rights to a Dad without a damn good reason given how biased most courts are against Dads.
If SD wants to be in softball, Dad agrees to allow it, and Dad can afford it then Dad should take SD and pay the fees since SD wants it and you know BM won't pay. If SD doesn't want to go, he doesn't take her on his time or pay for it. Pretty simple. I don't see how taking SD to something she doesn't want to do is supporting SD - it's supporting BM.
How many activities is this 8
How many activities is this 8 year old signed up for during a 12month period.
It's easy don't over schedule this child and it sound like the poor kid is. IF she likes dance...then it is dance. IF she likes soccer then it's soccer but for soccer season ONLY. not soccer basketball, girls baseball, tap chorus and of course there is drama. LOTS of drama classes.
IF mom signs her up, moms pays. IF dad signs her up dad pays especially when consent was not given and two if it interferes with either parents time.
Hope it works out. ***IF MOM is not following the court order it is time to have it enforced, unfortunately***.
The way we do it here is that
The way we do it here is that either parent can sign SS up for whatever they want: SS tells us he wants to play TBall but BM tells us SS says he wants to do Soccer. They are during the same season so DH, who has custody, agreed saying: "You can sign him up for Soccer but the rules are the same as before. If he gets bad behavioral or grade reports from school he will not go to practice/games on my time. If TBall practice and soccer fall on the same night, we will take him to TBall instead since that's what he told us he wanted to do first and what he tells us he likes best." She didn't like that answer but so far it's all worked out fine. She is responsible for paying anything she signs him up for and the equipment. She doesn't ever pay anything towards football or TBall so she knows not to ask for half of soccer.
When SS got into band we
When SS got into band we attempted to get the SpermClan to pay for half of his instrument costs. At about that same time they pushed for a CS modification hearing in an attempt to lower their CS costs associated with my Skid. Though they lost the CS mod and their CS actually went up by nearly 800% we did get clarification from the Judge that CS included the NCPs participation in all Skid related activities and expenses with the exception of his obligation to support half of any medical related costs not covered by insurance. After that we never again attempted to get the SpermClan to participate in the cost of any Skid related activities.
We signed the Skid up for anything and everything we felt like and made no effort to get the SpermClan to participate in the least. Not a difficult thing to do when we were the CP household and the NCP clan never lived nearer than 1200 miles to where we were.
So just an update, it turned
So just an update, it turned weird. My MIL (who we dont talk to or have anything to do with) called and asked if DH would let her take SD8 to softball on his weeks. He said that was fine and he was ok with taking her. So then he gets a text the next morning that SD wasn't going to play after all, that SD8 told BM and MIL that she never wanted to play and was upset they didnt ask her or even listen to her (apparently in the middle of Academy). So even though the day before when DH said this and was told they paid so she was going to play, they decided that they were going to force her. Which is fine, just a really weird ending.
Also to clarify, the events SD8 has been involved with have been over a 4 year period, not all at once. Currently she is only in cooking classes twice a month.
Well, if the child enjoys the
Well, if the child enjoys the sport go buy a ball glove for $20 and some baseball pants or whatever. You are getting wrapped up in what is fair for your dh and trying to 'show' the mom she can't make you. There is a reason they are divorced. She is an unreasonable witch for one. If you change your goal to doing what is right for the kid instead of winning over the Mom you win because you are the better people. And yes, we have done that, for example buying sd snowpants when we found out she was hanging out on the basketball court at recess with the other kids who didn't have any because her Mom who got huge amounts of child support couldn't be bothered to spend it on her. Why did we do it? Because spending a few bucks we didn't 'have to' and making an 8 year old's life a little nicer was more important than showing the Mom who's boss.
BM is a parent. She can
BM is a parent. She can pretty much sign the kid up for anything she wants to sign the kid up for.
That said.... DH is the CP and does not have to support the activity initiated by BM for the kid.
BM has supported none of the activities DH signed the kid up form.
I agree with your DH... he shouldn't pay for sports equipment for a sport BM signed the kid up for without first consulting him. She did not cover any of the equipment costs for the previous sports the kid was in. It is her turn.
I'm going to ask a question
I'm going to ask a question that no one has discussed yet... what country/state/region etc do you live in? The law isn't the same in all areas.
Where I am, if one person has custody, then the other isn't legally allowed to sign the child up for anything. So I wonder if the term "custody" might be misused here. When you have equal custody, no one should be able to sign a child up for an activity without the consent of the other, and the person who didn't agree in advance shouldn't have to pay, but in reality, if the activity is looked at as reasonable (ex a single sport, recreational, not involving high costs) then a judge will order the parents share the expense, regardless of whether they were consulted in advance.
This is a double edged sword - she might be able to get you pay, but you can do the same to her.
My thoughts? Pick your battles carefully. Legal battles aren't cheap, so make them count if you want to start them.
Just my 2 cents! Good luck!
In our state there is a
In our state there is a difference between "physical custody" and "legal custody." "Physical" is whoever the child is with the most. "Legal" covers things like school, medical, religion, etc. They can be divided or given to one parent only - and it doesn't have to be the custodial parent.