Weather

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OK...I'm sure I'm going to get lots of flak from this, but I have to say my piece from my own experience and perspective.

Recently there have been comments from stepmoms about not wanting children going out in certain types of winter weather. Some of my favorite stepmoms on this site btw :-)...

And I just have to comment...

LET THOSE KIDS OUT!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I'm older than most and remember days where you rode bikes on the streets, skied, played in the snow, ran around wild outdoors without pads, helmets, cell phones, etc... Now I know we live in a different world now, and everyone watches their kids much more carefully, and god forbid they don't have a helmet on bike riding or snowboarding...just in case...but please, despite all that, try and let kids be kids.

My purpose here is just to put things in perspective as I live in Alaska. School doesn't close here. It can be 60 below with ice fog and the buses still run and kids still go to school. We've had a foot of snow the last couple of days, and the roads are hell and the avg temp without windchill is 4. Schools are open. Kids are playing.

Just layer them up and let them the heck out. It's good for them. Their chances of dying out there are almost nill. I bet you anything they have a greater chance of getting themselves injured inside! If they get cold, they'll come in. Really. How many kids have you heard of getting any kind of serious frostbite? Few if any. I've had it. I know how it happens and the extremes it takes to cause it. It's not going to happen in a couple of hours at -5. Even with windchill as long as they are layered up and have good shoes they can last a long time at extreme temps. They can be out there like our kids are. Let them learn for themselves. Let them feel that sense of adventure. Let them be brave. Let them dream of being like Hillary climbing Everest, or more recently Veisturs or our Polar Explorers... Let them toughen up. I personally think it's really good for them.

And I did this with my son. My favorite photo of him is at Sunrise in Alberta, Canada at the top of a ski slope with the wind blowing and the temps well below zero. He has one of those crazy "mental" hats on, and goggles and is bundled up. We both had a blast that day. And he's as proud of that photo as I am. It was truly brutal, yet we had a blast.

Like I say, just my perspective...maybe it's helpful, maybe not. But with our long winters, if our kids stayed inside and were constantly out of school, we'd kill them :-).

I really hope this helps rather than hurts!

Take care stepmoms and if your kids want to escape to the outdoors...dress them and let them!

My kids played outside in

My kids played outside in everything but a tornado. If they stayed in all the time I would have gone crazy. Plus some of our best memories are being together hiking, rafting and snowboarding. I think they were much healthier in the long run by getting so much exercise.

LOL....

You can flash freeze at -100, so unless you have Antarctic expedition gear, I wouldn't recommend going out in it....but -60 is doable...although I'd have to say it's the limit...unless you are Inupiat or Siberian Yupik Eskimo. When I'm in the extreme north, I always think about how these people have survived the winters for thousands of years, and I'm in awe.

HERE HERE!!!! I second

HERE HERE!!!! I second Rae...

Geesh- I must sound like a control freak or something

I wish I knew how to explain it's not just the weather, it's not that I don't let her go outside ever, and I know to people who have never lived with a BP/BPD person, that it's so impossible to understand that we are not just control freak parents who love to make her miserable then complain about the result.

I wish I could relay the fact that I really try to weigh my decisions heavily before saying no to SD for anything. Much like the mall incident the other day when many posters felt we gave in to her whining and ranting by allowing her to bring the friend along after SD was verbally insulting us for not getting her way. We let it go, because if we said no to SD for every time she is that way to us? She would NEVER leave the house, even on the most beautiful spring day.

She can't stop combating us to save herself. She has little to nil impulse control, which is not limited to arguing, but also to risking her safety.

So, in answer to your points, with regard to my SD anyway-

"If they get cold, they'll come in" ---She will in fact NOT. SD's only reason for stopping any activity is if we tell her to, she's bored, or if something "shinier" attracts her attention. Getting sick, difficulty breathing (she has asthma) or not being able to feel her fingers would not meet those criteria. Especially if she thought she could sneak over to a boys house we didn't know about. And it's not just her safety. She was using walking our puppy as a chance to sneak over to a boys house to hang out. I'm not sure where she left the puppy when she did it. I only figured it out on a day when it was negative 15 or 20 with wind chill, and she threw a tantrum when I told her the puppy didn't need to be out long enough for a walk in that temperature.

"As long as they are layered up and have good shoes"-------SD refuses to wear adequate clothing. It is an argument that I have given up on for the bus stop. She wears shoes with no socks out in weather like this, and can't wear a hat because it will mess up her hair, and the best coat I could convince her to get this year (b/c she was choosing not to wear any at all) is a lightly lined jacket. SOMETIMES she will negotiate warmer clothes if she gets to do what she wants, but usually it's another argument about my ridiculousness as a parent.

"Let them learn for themselves." SD's BPD doesn't afford her any self regulation or retention of past results/consequences of her impulsive behavior. If it sounds fun she will do it, no matter who tells her it's stupid (even her friends.) She brags about making bad choices over and over like it's funny.

"Let them be brave...let them toughen up." Oh believe me SD thinks she's brave already. But her definition is not being afraid to take extreme risks, because everyone else is exaggerating the potential consequences.

SD would keep doing something pleasurable regardless of safety. Really she would.

I have never had to tell my sons no, and would say they do a fair balance of outside/inside in the winter, as well as summer, unless it's ungodly cold or hot. If it's like it was the other day they go out, get cold, come back in. They self regulate. They make mistakes and correct the behavior the next time.

I don't remember if I mentioned it in the post, but because SD's Dr often said to me, "Don't say no just to say no (which is easy to do with this kind of child) I always double check if I am doubting a decision. So I did call DH and let him decide based on weather, the above realities of SD's personality, and her asthma.

And lastly I will say that I do get that you are more used to cold weather in Alaska, than we are in Ohio. We are more used to it than the southern US. I know that we were all sporting winter coats at a Football game last fall for DH's reunion, and a couple there from Alaska were laughing because it was only 30 degrees. Well, after a month now of negative temps, 30 degrees feels like a sauna to me as well. Your kids are likely more weather savvy than mine.

"Om Tare Tutare Ture Mama Ayurpunye Jnana Putin Kuru Svaha"
~Sita Tara Mantra

I understand, believe me I

I understand, believe me I do. First because I live with a man who has BPD. I frequent a site called Facing the Facts which helps me to understand. I've thought of leaving numbers of times, but stay...I'm on the board where you are choosing to stay with your BPD partner. There are boards for parents and kids too if you haven't been there, although I suspect you've found it. Walking on Eggshells was an incredible, eye opening read. I am not alone and neither are you.

Second, I am severly asthmatic, even as an adult, unfortunately. As a kid, I was the girl in the plastic bubble. Cold can be tough on asthmatics. You MUST cover your mouth when it's cold. If I'm out climbing or backpacking for a long period of time (weeks...as in expedition), I have to bring antibiotics, steroids, and multiple inhalers...just in case. I usually find myself having to use my inhaler much more frequently. I hate it, but that's the way it is for me. Your SD needs to learn how to take care of herself.

And I agree with you, if she won't take steps to protect herself, such as dressing appropriately and being aware of her potential for an asthmatic attack, you cannot let her go. But then it becomes her decision not to be rational. I know with BPD it's nearly impossible to say anything if they are not in a receptive mood and it's a tough place to be.

I'm no psychiatrist, but I still think I would have let her out. My BPD partner also goes for extremes. In every way, but when it comes to the outdoors, he's climbed or attempted to climb major peaks, he loves extreme adventures...he's been that way since a child. No one would have been able to change him. His mother has talked to me about it. I think it's vital to his self definition and existence. But I understand it's a hard thin line.

And I think the more north you are the tougher and more aware you are of handling and dealing with the cold. Although my son grew up in the southern appalachians and still discovered some sense :-). When he first came up here, he didn't layer. He quickly learned that wouldn't work at all! Like I said, you don't hear of many kids getting frostbite! Up here, unfortunately, the accidents and deaths come mostly from snowmachine accidents, not exposure.

I sent you this in a pm!

Before I read the post.

We rarely limit SD for her asthma. But sometimes because of the BPD/BP ability to convince herself she's invincible, we do have to slow her down. The last time she had a severe respiratory infection, we gave her a breathing treatment for the first time in about 5 years and it didn't seem to do much. The next morning I made her stay home to go to the Dr, as she was about out of her rescue inhaler. SD had stopped complying with Advair and Flonase in the fall, and seemed ok without, so the Dr let her try to stop. Well, then she admitted to the Dr exactly how much she'd been relying on the rescue inhaler for sports, and the Dr said "BACK ON ADVAIR AND FLONASE!" the Dr also told her it was a good thing I made her stay home and confirmed no practice that night.

SD was peeved and whined non-stop all day (I posted about that one) much like the recent posts. It's relentless, her protesting about the unfairness in life, her complaining about any parenting decisions we make.

I ad mire you staying with your SO. I couldn't do it. I know it now. I've had a few BP/BPD friends in life, one I had to let go when she was targeting friends as an identity theft and was found guilty. The other has come and gone from my life as she is capable, and I'm ok with that. But I don't have to stay or take if she became verbally insulting/abusive to me.

With SD I feel I have no choice but to take it, and it leaves me feeling very blue.

I did try the Eggshells forum, if that's the one you mean, and I didn't like it. It was really hard to follow threads because that size of membership is wildly unorganized for a yahoo group forum.

I was wondering if they have a Facebook group or if there's another set up more like this one is. I had a hard time getting to know people on that one.

"Om Tare Tutare Ture Mama Ayurpunye Jnana Putin Kuru Svaha"
~Sita Tara Mantra