What happens when SS moves back in after college?
By reading these forums I have become aware of the real-world possibility of SS14 moving back in with us after college. I have been thinking that when he leaves for college, I will only have to endure the occasional visit, then I will be permanently free once he's done with college, when I had been assuming, he leaves for good.
But this forum - and reality in general - has caused me to realize that my woes are only beginning. Out there in the real world, there are rules and DW is a highly permissive parent and in contrast to having to be responsible out there, we may find him back on our doorstep, and of course, my wife would let him in, "because he needs me."
I just pointed him out to my wife, (as SS14 was in front of the TV, the area I call his "cage," where he spends a good part of the day, playing video games and soiling the rug with his food crumbs and spilled soft drinks), saying, "Take a good look at him there and imagine him at 25 years old, still at home, still doing what he's doing now. He will be everything he is now, only older."
Her response was, "He's going to meet someone nice in college." That's DW's plan to get him to move out. She's assuming he's going to live with a girlfriend, and we'll be done with him. (If this does happen, he will treat his girlfriend like he does his mother, which means it will be an abusive relationship.) DW's comments have the overtones of "he will marry a nice girl," which is even less likely than the girlfriend scenario.
The reason I mention all this is to ask how to deal with bio parents who are 1) extremely permissive and have the bratty kids to prove it, 2) are in fantasy land about the outcome of their kids' futures - that is, they believe their kids will launch successfully into life without having done anything to put them on the path of being responsible, and also, 3) for any pointers on how to get even a little of this across to my DW.
As of this week, I have completely disengaged. I have disengaged from time to time in the past, but always got back in their and tried to expect the things of SS14 that would be reasonably expected of any child. It doesn't work, because with a permissive parent in the house, it's like trying to fill a up a bucket with a hole in the bottom.
My kids are now teens, and I
My kids are now teens, and I agree with you that it is a very real possibility that one or both will come back home. Or stay here during college. And I'm okay with that. As long as they are working and/or attending school they can pay me a little rent and help out, respect our house, and we will all be happy. But I did not re-marry or have someone move into the home that would be against that. I come here to avoid making that mistake. I would rather my kids have a nice home with family then go out on their own and waste money on rent or pay a mortgage. My son has already been planning on saving for a cheap, small home that he can fix up, then get another, and so on, so he never has a mortgage. I know there is a difference between a kid with no aspirations who has never been encouraged to make something of himself, and a kid who has actually been parented. The sad thing is, most parents like me don't tend to remarry because we are invested in raising our children right rather than looking for someone.
To answer all your questions, you can't change your dw or ss. You can only change how you look at it. The best thing to do is stay disengaged.
Well, you are assuming he
Well, you are assuming he will leave for college. My SS 22, and SD 19 still live with BM with no forecast of launching. BM is permissive, and more friend than parent.
My DD has known since she could grasp the concept of college, that she's going, not optional. That is her view of normal after HS. And I do believe a lot of it is parenting style.
He will meet a "suitable for
He will meet a "suitable for him" user/loser and they will both move into your home. And then they will start having babies for you to raise.
Yes, I believe it will be a
Yes, I believe it will be a user/loser relationship. I see how he treats his mother, so I would expect this to be his pattern. He will balance kindness with cruelty, which is the mix he uses to keep his mother under control. (He's been asked why he doesn't do this to me, and his response was, "Because it doesn't work.")
He will get a girlfriend who will "see the good in him" and "try to change him," which means that he will know that she is into the relationship more than he is, and it will be all downhill from there.
One of the reasons I would care about this / how it would effect me, is what happens when I get calls from angry parents of a girl who he is treating this way? He hasn't started dating yet (though I understand now, it's "hooking up") but I wonder what it's going to be like when that happens.
sueu2, There's a lot of truth
sueu2,
There's a lot of truth to what you say, particularly the idea of they're going to do what they're going to do.
Both have their agendas and neither are going to change the way they're being, especially SS, and that I am convinced of (at least by now, I wasn't before). They're going to live the way they want.
The difficult thing is to watch some of their behavior (which would be happening anyway, whether I disengaged or not. His screaming and whining at her, their kissy cuddly behavior (he alternates between clingy affectionate behavior and whining and tantrums).
I haven't commented on, or put in my profile about how DW used to sleep with him until he fell asleep every night (up till 12 years of age) and how he used to climb all over her and lick her face (this stopped just last year) but I still can't endure him blowing kisses at her - although you would think I'd consider this to be good (because it's not a tantrum), but I guess it triggers all those memories of the enmeshed relationship they have, where if you didn't know, you might think they are boyfriend and girlfriend (they're both about the same size).
Also, trying to talk to my wife about what's going on leads to more bad behavior - not that I say that I'm causing this behavior. For example, when I was still engaging, he was manipulating his mother and I explained to her how he was doing it, by saying, "Now he's using fear..." "Now, he's guilt tripping you by doing..." And each time I'd expose and explain his tactics, he changed to another tactic. When he ran out of tactics, he rolled over on the floor and began to wimper. When I explained to DW what this tactic was meant to cause in her, he got up and ran to this room and screamed for one hour. Yes one hour. We timed it. I told DW to not go in there. Abruptly one hour later, he came out, and said to DW, "When I was screaming in there, I thought you were going to come in and comfort me!"
So, by disengaging, I hope to avoid these scenarios. By staying engaged, he will do these things and more, even resorting to physical violence to get the upper hand on me. (He's tried before.) Ironically, he's a Jekyll and Hyde character and is quite pleasant to people in public and at school, all the teachers think he's a great kid.
Nothing you can do except
Nothing you can do except plan an exit strategy. If your DW has no clue yet, I highly doubt she ever will. You'll either be used as the scapegoat by both, or blamed for trying to get between them. That's your role.
It's unfortunate because I frequently feel that these bio-parents purposely withhold the truth of their parenting ideals, leaving their partners unable to make better decisions for themselves until it's too late to walk away (without damage and divorce.) If you're unhappy with the current situation, YOU will have to do something about it and that may mean walking away.
I'm already considering an
I'm already considering an exit strategy. I don't think DW will get a clue if she hasn't by now. Attempts to get anything across to her is "demonizing" her son, "hating him" and "being mean" to him. If I talk to others outside the home, her response is the same. I should have quit engaging earlier. I've always thought, if I just can explain it to her, she will see. But she won't. It's hard enduring someone (even if it is her son) insulting my wife, but she doesn't seem to mind, or at least not enough, and is more likely to point the finger at me.
We've been through some pretty bad stuff with him, which I haven't mentioned on this forum.
My plan is to convince DH to
My plan is to convince DH to downsize our home when our 3 oldest go to college. It won't be hard because property taxes are so high in our area. I'm told grandparents should not have any couches... just love seats.
Some ideas, lol!
Exactly! The second I can,
Exactly! The second I can, we're downsizing. Getting the house ready for sale already and once my son is launched, it's househunting time. My ideal is one tiny guest bedroom, with a twin bed.
I told my DH a long time ago
I told my DH a long time ago that once high school is over, they are gone. If they don't go to college, they can continue to live in their grandparents basement with their mom (yes, their 40 year old BM lives in her parents basement). They will not live with us. And if SD14 gets knocked up between now and 18, no babies will be living here either. He knows I will leave if he allows either one of those things to happen. As long as my name is the one on the mortgage and I pay half of the bills, he doesn't get to let his kids live here beyond high school.
You have to lay down rules or leave. My DH raises his kids the same as your DW. They can do no wrong and he thinks they're such winners and will find someone to date, somewhere to live, a good job, good college, etc etc etc. But in reality they're lazy, can't have a 2 minute conversation with anyone, they don't understand empathy, they don't understand the concept of money or credit scores, they don't understand consequences, and they certainly don't understand a hard days work.
Sounds like your DW needs to
Sounds like your DW needs to read "All the Single Ladies" and get a grip on what it coming: young women are outlearning and outearning young men and they are no longer willing to put up with man-babies who bring nothing to the table.