Why is the world so full of idiot men?
My DW's grade school BFF just filed for divorce from her apparently serially adulterous idiot DH of 25 years. Serially adulterous because he apparently cheated about 7 years ago while she was going through breast cancer, a double radical mastectomy, reconstructive surgery, etc....
Anyway.... They sold a rental property that they had owned for years. When it sold he agreed that she could use the profits from the sale to open a apothecary/spiritual witchy magicy business. My words, not theirs.
Meanwhile nearly two years later and back at the cauldron the business that he expected to be a ~$15K/mo revenue business profiting a couple of thousand $ a month is netting $30-$40K a month and has my DW's BFF fully engaged in running it, teaching auring classes, etc....... They used to do C&W dance lessons each week and hit the C&W clubs together nearly every weekend but once her business started booming, she could not go to lessons though they still his the clubs on the weekends together.
When she opened the business he was the more knowledgeable spiritualist wizzardy person in their marriage. She ended up with a highly regarded mentor in the "arts" and has become a recognized authority in the Wiccan community. Her business has exploded.
So, his fee fees got hurt and he started cheating with a new dance class partner. She found their long romantic and often sexual text conversations and she got a lawyer.
We met her for dinner a couple of months ago and she was telling us that something was wrong, she was afraid he was trying to poison her (with some of her spiritual supplies that are apparently toxic), and that she was afraid that their marriage was on the rocks due to his issues with the success of her business. As it turned out, she was right about the marriage though it does not appear that the poisoning concerns were legitimate.
By all appearances he cheated because he could not stand that his wife had become successful. I don't get that at all. I am extremely proud that my wife is an amazing professional and extremely successful. I was proud that she took the financial lead during my 2 year post RIF intermittent consulting period from 2019 until 2021. On a humorous note, she commented during our conversations this evening "damn, you make more than me again" as she was doing her CPA witchery on our bills and finances, I told her that I was fine if she made more money and that if it was important to her I would come home and be her kept man again. She laughed, told me that was not funny, and said nope, keep supporting her to the manner to which she has been historically accustomed. Which I am more than happy to be able to do again. My new job is great and I am hopeful that it is my last rodeo for 8-10 more years until we retire, knock on wood... or light some sage... or something.
The business had remotely monitored cameras and security system that he was using to keep an eye on her, to make sure she was not cheating, while he was playing hide the sausage with the dance class mate.
Her attorney advised her to have the security system reconfigured to block him out of access, empty the house of the things she wanted, get her own place, get her concealed hand gun permit and to shoot him if he approached her or her business. She was already licensed. Gotta love Texas!
We became moderately good couple friends with them once my DW and the BFF reconnected. When we moved back to Houston it turned out that our house was only a few miles from theirs. We got together fairly regularly for lunch on the weekends, or for the girls to hit the nail salon while he and I shot the shit. I have always thought he had a confidence problem, a pretty notable chip on his shoulder, and a strong inferiority complex. So, I was shocked but not surprised by his bullshit if that makes any sense at all.
I just don't get idiot men. Yes, I know. I am a man, and I recognize that upon occasion that I can be an idiot as well. But... not in the same way this dipshit has turned out. My bride's success is a source of great pride for me. Not because it has anything to do with me, but that it is due to how incredible she is.
While the whole goat sacrificing (Joke), stick burning, rock rubbing, candle burning, naked dancing in the woods, chanting thing makes no sense to me, I would be extremely proud of how successful my DW's BFF has done if I were her DH, though I doubt it would last long if I were married to her due to my constant laughing at the whole Norse Magic path thing that seems to be excelling at.
So, what is it about us men that makes so many of us complete idiots when it comes to the women in our lives?
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Because societal views on
Because societal views on acceptable behavior by men toward women haven't changed even though the ability for women to live independent from men has.
It has only been in the last 50 years that married women could have a credit card in their own name. That's only one to two generations ago - many people are still alive during a time when women were not financially independent and were legally not allowed to be financially independent. Cheating used to be something men could do because women had to really be willing to tough it out if they were to leave. Employers could question why they were working, why they were divorced, how many kids they had, etc. The prospect of poverty kept many women in toxic relationships, and by the time they were granted full financial freedom, didn't have the skills and work history to build a lifetime's worth of wealth in their golden years.
The men who were brought up in that generation have raised the Gen X and older Millennials. The women in those latter two generations were the first with full financial freedom, and they have been flexing that by not staying married and not giving a flying F about how that makes them look (probably because they have the means to take care of themselves and don't have to have a relationship to keep them happy). The men from those generations, though, are the first to live through this and haven't fully adapted to "the new norm" because it wasn't something their fathers like fought for but likely fought against. Or, more likely, they didn't realize they were raised with a toxic mindset, or at least with a real sense of the consequences for their actions, so they do dumb stuff until they get a sharp correction. Then they either learn from that or become bigger a-holes who blame women for their problems because "their parents had the good life" not recognizing that either their mother was cool with the arrangement OR was a prisoner of her circumstances.
Now, that's certainly not ALL men, and in western European culture, women spent hundreds of years with limited freedom and independence. It's going to take longer than 50 years to rewire idiot brains because it will take generational change, raising new cohorts with different views, etc. Women still have to learn not to put up with this crap. Idiot women also have to stop using the system to hurt men, and the system has to change to protect everyone regardless of them being women/mothers. Those systemic pieces is what keeps idiot men and women doing what idiot men and women do. Change the systemic pieces so they reinforce good behavior and outcomes for all, and the idiocy starts to die down more and more.
This.
This.
And maybe everyone, including Rags himself, should quit referring to women as whores. That language contributes to the culture of violence against women.
I absolutely get your point Ipso.
Though I do not generally refer to women as whores. I refer to one woman as a whore. I would also be an equal opportunity applicator of the whore label if I were to apply it beyond the context of my serially adulterous XW. The label absolutely fits her. A man who does this crap is no less a whore than a women. Man whoredom is real.
I have no issue with people who have multiple partners or a long string of serial partners except within the context of a commited relationship. In that context, the label is applicable.
As for violence towards women, I would be the first to step in if that were happening within my sight or within my circle of family or friends. I was raised by a gentleman and a lady who made it clear that a man never strikes a woman and that women are to be respected and honored no less than a man.
And again, I absolutely get your point.
I think they did a study
Some time ago, when a number of women started out earning men. Conclusion?
Women still like the man to make more than they do and be provided for.
Men still like to be the providers and make more than the women.
This applies to Gen X and Millennials as well.
" old-fashioned" traditions are still fashionable it seems-- this is no where more noticeable than in Family Court where non-custodial women often earn more than custodial dads yet get away with paying no support.
When the woman out earns the man, apparently the man's self-esteem falls to a new low and he is more likely to cheat. She in turn is more likely to be resentful that she is out earning the man and will chastise him about being "lazy" AKA rub it in.
It becomes a vicious cycle.
This is an interesting study because I have been divorced twice but both times it seemed that my previous partners had no problem with me supporting the family all by myself. However they did cheat on me in the long run.
Chef believes he earns his keep, which he probably does in all honesty, by doing lots of sweat equity. He loves to grocery shop and cook. And to a lesser extent he likes to clean the kitchen.
On paper, it looks as though he earns next to nothing as all the money he makes goes into the business, which is in my name exclusively.
I control all the finances but let Chef have a free rein with a business credit card. He is not very frugal or wise about getting the best prices and in that arena there is certainly room for improvement.
He does tend to come to me to tell me he got a great deal from time to time which he is very proud of and loves to tell me about because he knows I am extremely frugal.
The cheating is not justified IMHO, however as my father used to say, "it takes two to tango."
I'm not convinced all men actually like women
When I think about some of the idiots in my own life, I'm not convinced the men actually like women as people. If you understand what I mean. My DH really enjoys the company of women as people which means we have a real friendship as well as romance.
Plus I completely agree with l-dad that the cultural change is going to take a few more generations. In the western country I spent most of my childhood in, my female friends were expected to go straight home after school or college to help with the household chores (ironing for the men of the family, cooking, cleaning, etc) while their brothers were allowed to just turn up to eat and grab their freshly ironed clothes from the wardrobe. It disgusted me at the time but it is slightly understandable as most of the parents were one generation off a farm. In a patrilineal agricultural society, boys were seen as more valuable as they would take over the farm and look after the family. It takes a generation or two to get rid of this thinking.
Finally, the BFF's soon to be ex sounds whiney and entitled.
Men with low self-esteem
Men with low self-esteem cheat because they require validation from others to feel good about themselves.
Wow. What great perspective.
Wow. What great perspective. Thanks for that everyone.
I really don't care about why idiots are idiots. That they
are idiots puts them in the write off box in my very black and white world.
My parents have a very traditional marriage. Mom always wanted to be a wife and mother. Dad was the earner. However, they have always been BFFs, equity life partners, and all in as each others "the one". They raised us to be respectful of women and men, to honor our partners, and set the example for our own children.
Interestingly, my extremely successful younger brother has the prototypical traditional marriage. Mine is not, neither of mine have been. I have always loved intelligent, confident, dynamic women and I won the incredible bride lottery, the second time I played, and am truly blessed to have been raised as I was and to share life with my bride.
I apparently have no ability to comprehend the choices of idiots.
My mom and dad just celebrated their 59th last month. My brother and his wife will celebrate their 28th in Oct, and in a few weeks my DW and I will celebrate our 27th. All of the kids for the three generations that my parents, my brother and I and our wives, and my parents GKs are all doing well.
My niece just married her groom in April. They are both wonderful people who are intelligent, educated, and successful professionals. I they are also both the product of long term successful marriages between loving life partners. My nephew, my brother's middle of three, is in an odd relationship. He and his GF are both brilliant, like scary smart, seem to be prototypically the poster example of the evolved generation. They are also both wonderful people. Their perspective is they have a disdain for marriage, disavow the trappings of success, though they are both very highly compensated young professionals and have the lifestyle that comes with that. Their relationship is not surprising, at least from the GF since she is a COD with an elderly severely ill father and a remarried young mother and has three very young sibs.
Relationships are interesting to watch. Even when they include an idiot.
Thanks again for the perspectives.
Here's a link to one of the studies (article)
https://www.marketwatch.com/story/can-american-men-ever-be-happy-if-thei...
Speaking of serial cheaters..
Speaking of serial cheaters...my BIL and his wife have a long history of being repeatedly unfaithful to each other. When I was introduced to them they gave me the spiel about being high school sweethearts and still in love blah blah years later. I just sat and nodded and bit my tongue on wanting to say "so that's why ya'll cheat on each other?". They are now separated and she is not allowed on my property for a lot of reasons.
I believe people who cheat
I believe people who cheat have absolutely no self respect at all. It is repulsive behavior, a filthy way to live and there is never an excuse for it no matter how hard done by you may think you are by your spouse.
I think if this site has
I think if this site has proven anything it is that idiots come in all shapes and sizes. We’ve got everything from the idiot HCGUBMs to the idiot Disney dads. ToxicTroll, Beaver and BioHo are all women. It’s an even spread. Who knows why they’re idiots. It’s as hard for us sane people to put ourselves into an idiot’s shoes as it is for an idiot to pretend to be a sane person. If they could manage that and understand where we came from maybe they wouldn’t be idiots!
I think that they are separate issues
I mean, sure the fact she is succesful might the "reason", but its really not. Its an inherant character flaw. Among other things. Hes a narcissistic pig who lacks empathy. etc.
Thats wonderful that shes doing so well, and helping people doing that. She sounds delightful. I myself am split between traditional religions and "alternatives" to traditional religions.
I make a little more than my husband. On paper.
Hes very happy and proud of my successes. We jab at each other about it, but he absolutely loves it when I foot the bill for an expensive meal out.
She is a sweet heart and a
She is a sweet heart and a beatiful woman. Her DH is a bit of a troll and I have always wondered how they became a couple.
Like you, I do not adhere to any formal religion though I am a spiritual person. Neither do I adhere to any structured rituals in my spiritual life.