OSD nominates BM for MOTY
Well, BM had the first (and only) conversation with OSD since her psychotic episode, about her psychotic episode, and guess what? Oh I'm sure you all know!
Everything is totalllllly fine now, you guys!! OSD sees how hard her mom is trying and BM says she's doing better than ever so really, is there even any need for supervised visits anymore? I mean, she's definitely ready to move passed all the things that have happened now that she knows how her mom has been feeling this whole time. And when she talks to FCS, she doesn't have to talk about that "other stuff" that happened, right? She can just say she's in a better place with her mom, can't she? Because really, now that they've talked (seriously, on conversation about more than 16 months of ignoring it) everything is soooo much better and we can just go back to normal now!! Yay!
Kill me. Kill me before I kill her. (Figure of speech for any pearl-clutchers.)
DH and I have fallen prey to the lying, flip-flopping teenager who cannot understand reality. A month ago, OSD was bawling her eyes out to me and DH because BM never listens to her, doesn't see how her (BM's) actions hurt her and YSD, won't follow the court order, etc. and how uncomfortable it all is to be "the adult in the situation".
Two weeks ago, OSD is angry and upset that BM has changed visitation days (per the emergency hearing -- because schedules are very emergency you know) and now her visits fall on basketball days and BM won't let her play and is talking her out of the league.
Last week, when DH and I were out of town, OSD was so worked up over talking to her mom about being allowed to play basketball that she couldn't sleep the night before the visit and made my mom (the skids stayed with my parents while we were gone) call our hotel at 1 AM when we didn't answer our cell phones because OSD was crying and practically hyperventilating about having to talk to her mom about something she knew her mom would be pissed off about and she was really scared of making her mom upset and how her mom would react and if she'd be safe.
But this week? Never mind! Life is soooo good. All because they talked. Kinda. One time.
Here are some highlights from the conversation that has given OSD the "proof" that her mom is better.
- OSD can't play sports right now because BM needs to be with her to work up to unsupervised visits -- Uh, no? You need to attend reunification counseling with your kids to get unsupervised visits, loser
- BM has been seeing a therapist weekly -- BM has stopped seeing any of her original two therapists and is using the reunification therapist that DH fired as her personal therapist now
- BM is finally on the right medication -- this may be true??
- This has been the hardest thing BM has ever gone through because she's just never had the chance to say that she's sorry to OSD and not being able to say sorry has been THE WORST-- BM has had weekly visits, sometimes twice a week since October 2018 so plenty of time to be sorry... if you're actually sorry and think you did anything wrong
- BM was "worried they might not survive the night" of her episode -- Plus one point for acknowledging you almost killed yourself and your kids; minus one point for letting the situation get to the point where you almost killed yourself and your kids
- She (BM) is "going to work harder to reach out to DH" if she ever feels an episode coming again -- yeah fetching right
In BM's defense, OSD also said that:
- BM stated she's been in denial about having mental illness and realizes she needs to manage it now -- Truth: BM has never, ever, ever said those words. She usually says she "didn't get enough sleep" or "had to work" and that's why she's had the episodes. If BM really used the words "mental illness" and said those words out loud, this is progress for BM
- BM admitted to being off her meds from April to August
- OSD told BM she did not like the old reunification therapist (the one BM is seeing for private therapy now) and BM stated she would call one of the new reunification therapists on the list (which DH has been asking her to do since October) -- Truth: BM did actually call one and DH has been in contact with this new therapist
This new development between OSD and BM has turned OSD into a witch and is causing a number of issues between her and I now. Last week remember, she was calling our hotel waking me up to talk to me because she was so stressed out about her visit with her mom, but this week, one of her newer friends called me OSD's mom and OSD said, with absolutely ice in her voice, "THAT'S just my STEP-mom." Which is fine, because it's true, but the way she said it made me do a double take. It was like... mean. I didn't even get a feminine pronoun. Lol. Not "She's my step-mom" but "THAT'S just my STEP-mom." (I love that I'm trying to using italics and capitalization to communicate the way she said it when I know 99% of the people reading this can already hear her tone with perfect clarity. Haha.) There's been other little digs like that that are coming out now that BM is back to MOTY with OSD and I am trying to be kind about it, but the truth is, I am so pissed.
We talk about dropping the rope on this site all the time. You know, DH and I wouldn't even be holding this rope if we hadn't actually considered her feelings and tears and fear to be truthful. And, honestly, I still think it's the truth. I don't believe OSD feels anything differently, except now she also feels hope. She wants so badly for BM to be her mom, the way she wants BM to be a mom (more like friend than parent, but also not someone who might kill her accidentally or on purpose) and she gets so excited for that potential that she abandons all the negative feelings because THIS TIME will be the time BM gets it together!
But I feel like I am, and almost my DH is, getting ready to drop the rope. We're going into family court in a few weeks with 1) a mentally ill BM who has vague letters from her many doctors, none of which give dates, the name of the mental illness, or treatment guidelines, but say simply that she has made so much progress in understanding herself and her actions and 2) a teenager who is too stupid to know her ass from a hot rock and thinks because her mom finally said something kinda true it's going to be sunshine and rainbows from here on out. I really feel like we are fighting a losing battle.
As harsh as it is, I think OSD needs a sit-down: Honey, a month ago you felt scared to be alone with your mom. Today, you feel so great about everything with your mom you are ready for unsupervised visits and even more. If you want to tell FCS that everything is amazing and you only have good feelings about your mom and you are ready to "go back to normal", then you are more than welcome to. But if it turns out things aren't as good as you want them to be, if BM still won't let you play sports, if issues come up where BM seems not quite right but she's not in a state of psychosis that we can actively see... you're stuck with that. We can't undo your words, and we can't keep fighting to protect you if you don't think there's anything to protect you from. When you change stories like this, it leads to distrust, and we don't know what to believe. You gotta pick a lane kid. We'll stand behind you, but you have to be ready for the consequences of either one.
Nicer though. All those points, but nicer.
I'm leaving a lot out because there's just always so much... I'll answer questions if I missed something/ something doesn't make sense.
Also, if OSD tells FCS everything is great and amazing, but YSD9 says she's still scared of BM and doesn't express the same enthusiasm for alone time with BM, does anyone have any experience/stories of how FCS might set up visitation in the future?
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Comments
Honestly - I know you care
Honestly - I know you care about these kids, but you've got to disengage from caring so much about all of this. Kids with crazy mothers flip-flop like this. They desperately want a normal mother and want to believe her when she tells them what they want to hear. It will take years, likely into her adulthood, for her to figure out who her mother is and what the truth is and isn't. You can't live with this level of upset about what BM does and doesn't do, what OSD says or doesn't say. Maybe, at some point in her adulthood, she will say, "You know, SM, you were really the only mother I had." Or maybe she won't, maybe she will end up being alienated and going to live with BM when she has the choice. But either way, do yourself a favor and learn not to care so much or give all of this so much space in your head.
It super sucks because they
It super sucks because they will always forgive their mom no matter how bad it was or is.
Drunkie Spawn was the same way with Meth Mouth.
OSD is all about "this is so
OSD is all about "this is so hard for my mom" boo hoo hoo. I just want to shout at her, "What about how hard this is for YOU?" And also, quieter, me. LOL. I'm not having the time of my life with this either, for the record, and it does make it harder to be nice to OSD. I am currently avoiding her because I'm not sure I can keep my tongue in check and not say what's on my mind in an less than appropriate way.
But more than that, what's really shaking me is the doubt this has put in me and DH. OSD is running the risk of becoming the girl who cried wolf. How are we supposed to take her feelings about BM seriously if she will recant them as soon as her mom says three nice words to her? Now, we lose credibility, create more animosity (as if there wasn't enough already) and waste time and money in court... and for what? Who will listen to DH when BM has letters and OSD says there is no problem? We have had to work so hard to get anyone to take it even THIS seriously!
There's also a layer of added tension because this last episode has been so bad. So, so bad. So many things I haven't shared here because it's been really bad, and so unique and very identifying. It's not like she's just a shitty mother. While she certainly is that, so what? That's not what this is about. Most people don't get "protection" from a selfish, disengaged mother so that's not really the problem.
The problem is that whole pesky schizophrenic/ bipolar/ psychosis disorder and how endangering her behavior is to the kids during those times. We don't see her often enough (thank God!) so what OSD says generally holds water because she can see BM's mania and psychosis very clearly. (Most people can, especially if she's in an active state and spending time with her.) But if OSD won't "report" that now to FCS, then what? And how much harder do we keep trying to get someone to take our side seriously?
So... I guess have a great time with your mom in her next psychotic episode if you tell FCS there are zero issues with your mom now, OSD! Hope you don't die next time.
I mean, it sounds so dramatic but it's actually miserably real.
It's frustrating. I'm unusually frustrated right now.
"Hope you don't die next time
"Hope you don't die next time." ...."it sounds dramatic."
No, it doesn't sound dramatic. It sounds like reality. I had a friend become bi-polar with psychotic episodes in our early 20s. It was a whole lot of WTF. She was a nurse... went off the rails. I actually think she lives on the streets (homeless), by choice, now. (Last I heard.) But, it was "something to witness."
Hopefully child services will be able to wrap their head around the fact that her mother is manipulating a teenager. And that the outcome of death of the children IS a possible outcome if they "make a mistake". It is a mistake that can never be undone.
Mental health treatment in the US is flippin horrible. I'm sorry your family is having to deal with all this mess.
I get it, we had custody of
I get it, we had custody of Drunkie Spawn and she would see Meth Mouth every other weekend.
One particular week right before visitation Meth Mouth was verbally abusing Drunkie pretty hard. It got to a point where she finally told DH about it and showed him the texts. Turns out Meth Mouth had stolen...er procured a tablet for Drunkie and Drunkie didn't want it.
Meth Mouth started going off about how she stole this tablet solely for Drunkie and that if she didn't take if off her hands some bad people were going to come for her and assualt her and the grandparents.
DH took Drunkie down to the police station and showed them the texts. The Officer was really kind and told Drunkie is she was scared she didn't have to go see Meth Mouth that weekend. He even called Meth Mouth to let her know visitation would not be taking place.
So you would think after all of that everything was done and over right? Nope come Saturday morning Drunkie Spawn is bawling her eyes out she just wants to go see Meth Mouth because she loves and misses her so much and she was never really scared, DH was the one who blew it out of proportion!
Yeah after that I stopped caring, when we found out that the house got broken into with Drunkie there and she knew all about it and was terrified and didn't tell us, lest she not see Meth Mouth again I just washed my hands of it.
Good gawd, these children! I
Good gawd, these children! I am nearing the point of washing my hands of it as well. It sucks. I do get scared for my SDs. Hell, sometimes I'm scared for my DH and myself. When BM is in an episode, it is a THING, and they are getting worse and worse, lasting longer and longer. She feels like a ticking time bomb and I don't know how to disassociate/disengage from that. But I am making myself crazy with it right now, and I can't stop my SD from saying what she wants to FCS so I have got to find a way to come to terms with this.
I do think I am also more emotional right now. It's been a rough couple weeks, and the holidays are coming, and for me at least, they are definitely not bringing out the best in me this year. I can tell I'm much more agitated over this now than I remember being in the past. But maybe that's even more reason to drop the rope.
I feel for you and H in this
I feel for you and H in this situation. You genuinely love this child and want the best for her. I don't have much input but if/when you do have a chat with SD tell her to soul search and to be honest about what she feels about her mother. I know BM is manipulating her and SD is relying on "hope". This girl desperately wants her mother to be fine and healthy but she has to be honest with herself because whatever she tells FCS will impact both her and her sister. I'd hate for her mother to have an episode and something happen to those girls because SD doesn't want to own the truth of the situation.
Her mother may not have it all together "now" but it doesn't mean in the future that she won't get better....to the point where they dont' have to fear for their lives. I know its difficult to have a child her age to understand this but it's worth a try.
Hope all works out in you and H's favor. This really is a tough situation to be in.
Thank you. This means a lot
Thank you. This means a lot to me. I really do love my skids. I don't have bios so I don't think, nor expect, the love to be the same but it is there and it is genuine. While I do sometimes get my feelings hurt -- like her snippy comment to her friend this week -- most of the time, it's not about me wanting to be "chosen" over BM. It's that I want SD to choose herself over BM. And seeing all that she's missing out on, and the danger inadvertently puts herself in by always choosing her mom over herself... it just hurts my heart so deeply.
I have calmed down since yesterday when I posted this (thank God for a place to vent!). I will probably speak to OSD about this in some manner, though not the way I'd written it yesterday. I've brought that particular train of thought and the conversation that goes with it to DH. I'm not sure what he will do with it, if he will say any of it, but I feel like my conscience couldn't stand it if I didn't say something and then, heaven forbid, a decision was made in court and then something irreversible happened. I really like your words and will probably use them. My goal isn't to force OSD to say what I want her to say. What I want her to say, of course, is the actual truth but that may be asking for too much. So it's more that I want her to try to grasp the impact her words will have, no matter what they are.
I still feel so yucky about it.
If you’re going to talk to
If you’re going to talk to your SD about this, I don’t think you need to word it ‘nicer’ than what you wrote. Your words were direct without being harsh, sugar coating things just jumbles the message, and this is an important issue.
That said, if anyone is going to say anything to her it should be your DH. Also, regardless of what she’s got going on right now, classing & calling you ‘that’ is 100% not ok. Have DH nip that in the bud pronto. Just because she’s having feelings about BM doing better doesn’t mean she gets to be an @sshole to SM. It’s not your fault her mother is mentally ill.
I would ask the social
I would ask the social workers why SD gets any say in how "safe" she "feels". SD is not a mental health expert, and she shouldn't be put in that position.
The problem is that OSD is
The problem is that OSD is the one who said she DIDN'T feel safe. So now she says she does.
And BM's stupid mental health
And BM's stupid mental health experts have written letters saying she's doing so great. She is on her third therapist this year now, so she has a number of letters to submit.
Some of my favorite excerpts from her notes?
"BM is consistently taking medication as is evidenced by her good mood". This, from a therapist who saw her a total of FIVE HOURS over six months. Blood test? Nah! Look at her, she's so happy. She must be taking the medication. Certainly this one hour a month is representative of her everyday feelings! I'mma go ahead and write it down for her.
Or my new favorite, "BM has consistently kept appointments except for times she missed her appointment due to scheduling conflicts". Um, question. How often are her appointments? Are these monthly appointments like her other therapist? Because, if so, that kind indicates she's not keep appointments. And, scheduling conflicts you say? Well, she works two nights a week as a server in a restaurant so... did therapy start during the dinner rush?
And is anyone at all going to talk about the fact that her letters say "manic episodes" not "psychotic episodes"? Because... big difference. Or maybe we can talk about that fact that she has had three therapists in roughly 13ish months, and only sees each one for maybe 5 months? Maybe. If she doesn't need to miss her appointment "due to scheduling conflicts".
She has stopped seeing her individual therapist, so that she can see the former reunification counselor for individual therapy though. Does that count?
Oh lort. It's too much to bear. That people write these things, and others read them and think all is well in her mind. I truly cannot bear it.
I can see this in my future
with munchkin sd13.
Shes being more and more sympathetic to non-working victim mother who is mother of the year...
egads. I deal with mental case too. The drama...
I think is the same as with
I think is the same as with alot of the delusional dads on here. They're stuck having this crazy person as an immediate biological family member and use denial and wishful thinking to cope with it. In that way it's easier for us (dont get me wrong, i think in some ways it's harder for us also) because we dont actually have to have this person as a relative and in theory could walk away and never see them again.
I can see that. And I can
I can see that. And I can possibly excuse it in a teenager, even though it makes me batty AF! There's no way I could handle this situation if my DH was in the same kind of denial as OSD. I'd leave them to it! LOL.
Honestly? Secretly? The ugly feeling that I'm struggling with right now is much closer to... how long does it take PAS to work? I mean, can we just pack her up and move her into BM's now if she's so ready and BM is so great? My patience is really wearing thin with OSD and my house is a more peaceful when I'm not sharing space with a flip-floppy denying liar, so JUST GO ALREADY! When a couple other members here talk about their SDs being PAS'd out and moving into mom's and cutting off contact... right now? Secretly I think that sounds kind of amazing because I am so tired of this BS and at least then it would be over!
But I'd never accept that as an option if I was able to stop it because I am afraid BM will hurt her. Maybe not immediately. But I don't think BM can keep her physically safe and I know she can't keep her emotionally safe.
In my mind, I can see the look on OSD's face all the times she was scared of her mom... the time she hid in the bathroom at the courthouse so her mom wouldn't see her after the FCS interview, all the nights she woke us up in at 3AM because she could hear something outside and she was worried it was BM trying to break in; I hear the panic and that crack in her voice that means she's holding back tears when she called the hotel freaked out about her visit with her mom, barely 14 DAYS AGO, and I know with my deepest knowing that she does not mean what she says when she says she's okay with her mom now. I know she wants it to be true but it just isn't and I pray, I pray that she can get real with that ugly kind of truth and just say things still aren't okay.
And if she's not yet brave enough to tell the truth, if she sells the "fantasy mom" version of the story? I don't quite yet know how I'm going to live with my own feelings of fear and frustration, and this weird feeling of loss and grief that keeps coming up for me as we go through this process.
Guess I'll be coming on here a lot more often. Haha...ha.