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Won a battle, lost the war?

Rhinodad's picture

So, Halloween is over... and it went pretty much how I expected. Another huge fight with DW, followed by exactly what I did not want to happen happening.

First, after lots of discussion (read: arguments), DW finally agreed to make Halloween a yearly affair. Meaning one year SD8 would be with us, the next she would be with her father, and so on. It was like pulling teeth getting DW to agree to this.

Then she decided to let SD8 choose who she would trick or treat with the first year. I saw that as a BAD idea, but ah well. So when we originally told SD8 about this she decided to trick or treat at our house, so she could go with her friends in the neighborhood. We were cool with that, and BS3 would tag a long for a little while. Well, in the weeks leading up to it, SD8 changed her mind about 100 times. Finally week of she decided on our house. And then the night before changed her mind and wanted to go with her father. ARGH!

So, SD8 decides to go with her father. DW (clearly frustrated that SD8 is not doing it with us anymore), calls BioDad to let him know. I hear the conversation and I can tell he asks her if he can bring her to OUR neighborhood to trick or treat. This was a huge issue in our previous argument about Halloween. But, of course, DW says it is ok.

To rehash: BioDad lives in an apartment. We live in a nice, gated neighborhood which we pay a large HOA fee to maintain. There are TONS of other neighborhoods around that are Angel not ours, (b) not gated, and (c) safe. If BioDad comes here he has to park in our driveway (as he would be towed from the clubhouse lot). Plus I know SD8 is going to want to stop in the house and that means BioDad is coming in and hanging out.

So, queue up another big argument with DW the day before Halloween. Again I tell her that this is bullshit, that if SD8 is going to go with him that BioDad needs to take her SOMEWHERE ELSE. It is not our responsibility to provide a neighborhood for her, make him get off his fat ass and do some work himself. DW always complains about how BioDad won't do anything himself, and instead expects everyone to do everything for him. Yeah, DW, it is because you all (and sometime encourage) it! Jesus Flipping Christ.

I tell her again that this pisses me off. She asks me why. "You are getting exactly what you wanted, we are not trick or treating with him, just us." Uh, no, DW... I'm getting PART of what I wanted. I also wanted you to actually stand up to BioDad and tell him to grow the f up and find his own place to go. But no, that isn't happening. I told her I'm sick of arguing about it, that clearly she doesn't care how I feel about the situation and I'm done with this BS. She made her position very clear. She argues that it is for SD8's sake because of course she wants SD in our neighborhood where it is safer.

I counter with: "If you are so scared that SD8 will not be safe while under the care of BioDad on Halloween, then you need to reevaluate your custody arrangements. All I ever hear from you is how you want to make sure SD is safe. Clearly you do not trust BioDad to keep her safe. IF that is the case, you need to fight for full custody."

That just made her more angry.

I continued and told her BioDad was not to park in our driveway this year. That I did not want SD8 and BioDad hanging out at our house. That we were NOT going to trick or treat with them even if we ran into them, etc. DW just said "fine" and walked away.

So, BioDad came over and parked in the grass swale, and across half the entrance to our driveway. Terrific. Give DW credit, however, she did not invite him in. (Sarcasm). They went trick or treating early and we waiting at home with BS3 for a while before we went. We, of course, ran into them a couple of times. Also when SD was done, they came back to the house and again DW did not invite BioDad in. Then BioDad left SD at our house and left.

So, DW tells me later that BioDad did not want to take SD out that night. He had planned on doing something else with his family. Tough shit, BioDad. You and DW let SD have control of your lives by letting her choose who she went with and continually change her mind - you buttered your bread, now you have to sleep in it.

AND to make it even more funny (for me), the only reason SD chose to go with her dad is because she thought BioDad's Fiance's girl (14) was going to come trick or treating with her. She did not. SD8 was pouty all night about that. Tough luck kid. You could have gone with your friends if you had come with us... or at least your little brother.

I'm left wondering if it is even worth arguing about this anymore. Clearly DW doesn't see my side of the issue... or just doesn't care.

Comments

Rhinodad's picture

Sigh. I don't know. I'm so freaking TIRED of arguing this shit. It never, ever, ever ends.

SD8 is an entitled brat already and it isn't going to change. I guess it is my job to make sure BS3 doesn't turn into one.

Rhinodad's picture

See, I thought she had seen it. A while back I mentioned in a blog that DW made a comment about how she does not like how SD is turning out exactly like BioDad.

I thought that revelation might change things. It has not.

IslandGal's picture

"I'm starting to think the divorce is hardest on the people who marry into the aftermath and become step parents."

AMEN to THAT!!!

Drac0's picture

I've been waiting for this post! I remember you posting about this in the summer!

So typical. You give DW advance warning and STILL get shafted.

Rhinodad's picture

You know she tells me that I'm being unreasonable because "I just want SD to be safe. Of course I feel more comfortable with her here in our neighborhood."

Again, if you are so concerned about where BioDad lives or where he'd take her trick or treating, clearly you do not trust him to raise your daughter. If you are that concerned about poor 'lil SD and BioDad's lack of ability to protect her... shouldn't you be fighting tooth and nail to get her full time? I know I would if I was in that situation and I felt BS3 was unsafe.

It seriously just makes me want to scream.

Drac0's picture

Wait! I know this tactic!

*looks it up*

Ah here it is. It's called "Argument of Mass Appeal".

It's one of the many argument fallacies employed by bio-parents. Of course she wants her daughter to "be safe". What mother doesn't want that for her children!? Using this tactic is a sure-fire way to deflect your wishe and break any previous agreement you guys had. My wife does this to me ALL the time.

Me: "It's past SS's bedtime. Why isn't SS in bed?"
DW: "Oh he is just putting the finishing touches on his homework. He's really into it so I let him be. I want him to get a good grade on it."

Me: "SS is wasting his dinner time meal and snacking on Nutella sandwiches later. I thought we agreed he is not to do this!"
DW: "Well I would rather not let SS go to bed starving and Nutella is a good source of energy. Remember SS has gym tomorrow. I don't want him to faint in gym class."

Me: "SS is late again. I believe you and I agreed that if he is late again, he is to be punished!"
DW: "He texted me to say he is walking Vicky home. He is being such a good boyfriend. Don't you want his girlfriend to be safe?"

It never ends....

ChiefGrownup's picture

I tasted Nutella once. It is FROSTING.

Great nutritional plan for gym, just great. And great table manners, too -- leave a nutritious dinner sitting there that someone worked on and planned. Just greeeaaat.

new to this's picture

My son was 3 when his dad and I divorced, these same thoughts crossed my mind because my exh was not the most responsible person around. But I kept reminding myself that he loves our son just as much as I do so he is not going to let anything happen to him. I just had to keep saying that over and over. Sure he might have taken him places and around people I didn't approve of but in the end he didn't let him get hurt or anything like that. Once you divorce you give up the right to make the ex be the person you want them too.

Rhinodad's picture

"You are going to end up resenting her - and SD."

Oh, we are LONG past that point, I can assure you of that.

Rhinodad's picture

This is part of the reason.

I also love DW truly. Of course there are things she does that drive me bonkers, this being one, but at the end of the day I love everything else about her.

And I don't resent all of DW. I just resent the fact that she can't see what I (and ever other non-interested observer) sees when it comes to SD and how she interacts with BioDad.

It is sad to say, but sometimes I resent SD because if it weren't for her DW and I would pretty much never argue. I guess I mostly resent BioDad because he is an ever-present pain in the ass in our life and a shitty parent. I'm a good parent who holds my kids (even SD) accountable for their actions (gasp), and all I get is shit on.

So yeah, there is some resentment there. But not enough to overcome my love for DW.

Rhinodad's picture

"Because there was no where else to park without getting towed."

Sure there was - in another neighborhood. Not mine.

Rhinodad's picture

I didn't dream of it so much as go along with it "for SDs sake" for several years.

That was until I started getting shit on for treating SD like a parent should. I quickly realized that SD thought all fathers should be permissive disney dads and that most of her attitude stemmed from him. Everything good that has been done for SD has pretty much been a result of me or DW. But listening to SD, you'd think it was the other way around.

Rhinodad's picture

EXACTLY THIS.

If it is that important to DW that she goes with SD and BioDad's crew, I told her that is fine - but I'm taking BS3 and we're going by ourselves. I shouldn't have to be put in the position of dealing with that jackass.

At least next year it will be our "turn" for Halloween... which will give BioDad absolutely no reason to come over here. But I bet he still will.

Rhinodad's picture

But why let him come to our neighborhood if DW isn't actually going with SD? Like I mentioned, we pay the HOA fee for this neighborhood, not him. We have to actually give approval to the gate to let him in. And there are plenty of other neighborhoods around. Why does BioDad feel the need to come here? (My theory is because he doesn't want to have to do any work in finding another place to go). This just follows the patter of BioDad letting everyone else do his work for him.

I suppose it was a victory that this year I wasn't forced to actually take BS3 trick-or-treating with SD, BioDad, BioDad's Fiance... So I won that battle.

When you get divorced and get joint custody you have to realize that this pretty much means your child is going to be split between two houses. If you didn't want that, you should either have Angel not gotten divorced, or (b) given one parent or the other sole custody.

Also... I've tried the "sit back and let DW raise the kid how she wants." A couple of times, actually. And we all know how that turns out - it ends up being another argument because "you need to be a fully invested parent of SD" or "why don't you treat SD the same as you treat BS"? It's a lose-lose situation.

Rhinodad's picture

Again, I'm fine with that, but don't drag me, my house, and the things that I PAY for into it. If DW is that concerned, go to his neighborhood with them. OR meet them somewhere.

Clearly DW is more concerned about SD trick or treating with BioDad than she is with me taking BS - I say this because she was generally ok with me taking BS without her when I threatened it... but for some reason has to oversee BioDad's trick or treating with SD?

Drac0's picture

I guess I am lucky that my DW and Donkeykong's CO stipulates that on Halloween nights, custody switches year to year. Donkeykong still finds a reason to fight though (jury is still out on how long trick-or-treating is supposed to last) but now that my SS is older both DW and Donkeykong just let SS decide what he wants to do. This year, SS went to his girlfriend's house to give out candy. Perfect excuse to hang out I guess.

This year, for the first time, things were really calm between DW and Donkeykong. But last year and every year before this? OMG! I rememeber one Halloween fell on a Saturday and Donkeykong wanted to take SS for the whole day. What a shitstorm that was!

I'm hoping that in a few years, when your SD is older, this issue will all be water under the bridge and SD will want to do her own thing and you won't have to deal with Machine Man at all!

Rhinodad's picture

Maybe it will be... but I suspect there will be some other issue to argue about then that is SD-related.

Rhinodad's picture

Thankfully, where we live, basements are not possible.

Buuut... she has her own room, so point taken.

ChiefGrownup's picture

I was waiting for this post, too. Rhino, these people are crazy. Making the little girl pick was epicly wrong in the first place but letting her endlessly flip-flop, are you freaking kidding me? You give kids small choices: "peas? or carrots?" "blue tights? or yellow?" "math first? or reading?" Not big loaded choices that affect other people and instantly put the kid in a loyalty bind. Good grief.

And that BD of yours, not only a lousy father but not much of a man, either. Why on earth doesn't he have the even the shadow of cajones it takes to not want to mooch your ex-w's and her dh's trick or treat neighborhood? And parking?

I feel sorry for you, Rhino. These people would drive me out of my mind. Next year, leave the guldurn house before ex has time to show up and cause trouble. And as soon as sd starts whining next year that she wants to go with daddy agaaaiiin, make it a rule that you aren't going to listen to it. I wish you could make it a rule she not be allowed to say it at all. But I have little hope of your dw enforcing that. But as sure as the sun rises in the east, sd will play this game every year. Trying to go with the wrong person on the wrong year, chronic indecision, and never being happy about any of it. That's what her parents bought for her when they put the choice on her little shoulders.

Rhinodad's picture

Except that is not it at all - he is leeching. It has nothing to do with living in the apartment complex. There is a nice neighborhood within walking distance of his apartment. Not only that but his apartment complex is actually pretty nice itself... we all live in a pretty good area. It's not like we are in some slum, he lives two miles away! AND she has friends in that apartment complex! She lives in both places and is comfortable in both...

Not only that, but SD ran into her friends here while trick or treating and BioDad had the opportunity to let SD go with them... and he didn;t because it was inconvenient to him and how quickly he wanted to get done.

Drac0's picture

>Seems she follows my logic more than yours.<

Which logic is that? Break a previous agreement she made MONTHS AGO with her spouse in order to pamper to an 8-year-old who can't make up her mind?

That doesn't sound like logic to me. It sounds more like Louis CK comedy!

"Sorry! We can't leave to go to the party! My daughter doesn't want to put on her shoes!"

ChiefGrownup's picture

Months ago in another thread I actually endorsed this idea for Rhino for the very reason that tons of unknown kids come to MY NEIGHBORHOOD. No, we don't look down on apartment dwellers. I've lived in apartments. No big deal. The point is that these people FIND their own neighborhood to go to. Rhino's BD CAN DO THE SAME.

Don't give me the little girl is "comfortable in this neighborhood." She made a CHOICE. She chose Dad OVER her friends. She expected to be going wherever dad took her. Little kids don't have any idea where they are on Halloween night, anyway. If a house is lit up and has candy, that's all they see.

BD could have chosen some other neighborhood or gone to his own apartments, or arranged something else for her. If he went to another neighborhood I believe he should come back the next day and pick up candy wrappers or make a donation to the local park or something. Be a freakin' man. An adult.

And Rhino did not sign up to date his sd's father for the rest of his life. If the 2 parents have to be together for every damn thing, do NOT GET DIVORCED.

This is a huge, colossal, putrefying infringement on Rhino's rights as a human being who never slept with sd's dad. And on his rights as a husband. And on his rights as a father of bs3. He absolutely does not have to spend any of his holidays with this other failure of a man and he does not have to freakin' date him like his wife wants him to!!!

Rhinodad's picture

I still do not know. I've brought it up time and time again. All I get is a huff and that is pretty much it.

I mean, come on DW... when you ask SD if she wants to go shopping, what answer are you expecting? You don't ask... you tell her she has to go with you.

joe376's picture

If the biodad of Rhinodads skid is anything like the biodad of my skids, you just dont want that guy coming around. Hell, I get a little twitch when my skids biodad pulls into my driveway just to pick them up. After years of dealing with this guy and his sneaky ways of depending on what I provide at my house, you HAVE to question every choice they make that involves you. Im sure Rhinodad has plenty of reasons to consider biodads choice of neighborhood as lazy and mooching on others. The biodad of my skids pulls the same type of stuff.

new to this's picture

I need to tape a week at my house and show to your DW, she can see what letting the kid make all the decisions at that age will get you at 16!! An immature brat who thinks she is grown. Very difficult to live with. If you think she is hard to deal with now just wait. COD have way too much authority.

IslandGal's picture

I'm with you Rhinodad! In my case - SO and BM both gave SD adult status and equal say in major decisions. Main one was my SO who treated her like a mini-wife.

By allowing her to make adult decisions, she now has the worst attitude I have ever seen in a child with their Father. She has had years of counselling with different counsellors, who have ALL given up on her. BM blames SO for her behaviour and now SO blames BM because he can't fix it.

Your DW is in for a nightmare when SD grows up. SD will NEVER, EVER respect DW, will treat her like a mate and will never listen to her advice. She will always be entitled, expect to be treated like a princess and will have a horrible time trying to handle it when life becomes complicated and challenging.

What disney parents are forgetting is the most golden rule of all:
"Teach your children to become independent, responsible adults". All these disney parents will be stuck with their kids right throughout their entire lives - I see it happening right now and I feel anxious for their futures. It's so friggin' sad.