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Long-- Need feedback on proposed custody agreement

northernsiren's picture

Hi folks,

We have a meeting with the lawyer on 1/10 to initiate custody proceedings for SD14. It looks like it's really going to happen! In an effort to do as much leg work on MY time rather than his expensive time, I downloaded the form from superior court for a custody agreement, and took a stab at drafting a proposal myself based on their guidelines, plus the wisdom I have read in these pages. Here's what we've come up with below. I would love your feedback, as I am really trying to minimize 6 months from now having to go back to court over this that or the other thing.

Oh and as a note, yes it's true, we are not asking for CS from BM. It seems to be her primary concern, and if it will ease this process to just let it go, we are willing to do it. SD will be 15 in less than a month, and so we're talking about 3 yrs of CS from an unemployed woman who has no intention of getting a job, just not fighting over.

Here it is, please let me know if anything is missing, or if there is anything else I can do to prepare for the meeting. Thank you!!!

Custody Agreement

The parties agree that:

The custody of the children shall be as follows:

Legal custody:
will be granted to father

Primary residence:
will be at father's residence

As to visitation with the children:
mother will have access to the child from 10:00 am on Saturdays-5:00 pm on Sundays on an every other weekend basis. Any deviations from this arrangement must be agreed upon by both parties no less than 2 weeks in advance.

Who will pick up and drop off for visits:
father is responsible for all Saturday drop offs and mother will be responsible for all Sunday drop offs unless otherwise agreed to by both parties in advance.

Holiday and school vacation visits:

Holiday Schedule:
Thanksgiving vacation 10:00 am Thanksgiving Day-the following Sunday at 5:00 pm: Mother

Christmas eve day from 10:00 am-10:00 am Christmas morning: Mother

Christmas morning from 10:00am-10:00am the following day: Father

These holidays to rotate each year.

Additional holidays:

Child's birthday, unless it falls on a scheduled visitation day: Father

Easter: Mother

Mother's Day: Mother

Father's Day 10:00 am-5:00pm: Father

Vacations:
February school vacation 5:30 pm Friday-following weekend Sunday 5:00 pm: Mother
April school vacation 5:30 pm Friday-following weekend Sunday at 5:00 pm: Father

Summer vacation:

Mother is entitled to two weeks of her choosing provided that the plans are made on or before 1/1 of each year. If arrangements are not made before this date, selected dates must be considered in light of any plans made by father for summer vacation or summer activities for child.

5:30 pm Friday-following weekend Sunday 5:00 pm

Father is also entitled to two weeks of his choosing for summer vacation trips.
5:30 pm Friday-following weekend Sunday 5:00 pm

As to the health insurance and unreimbursed medical costs:

father will continue to carry health insurance for child at no additional cost to mother. Mother will be responsible for 50% of all unreimbursed medical expenses.

As to child care costs:
mother will not be responsible for any child care costs

As to School and Extracurricular Activities:
Father will be responsible for determining child’s participation in any extracurricular and school related activities.

Mother will be responsible for transportation and ensuring child’s participation in said activities should they occur on her designated visitation days.

Mother will not be financially responsible for costs associated with these activities.

Child Support:
Father does not request child support from mother.

Comments

sparky's picture

"father is responsible for all Saturday drop offs and mother will be responsible for all Sunday drop offs unless otherwise agreed to by both parties in advance."
Should you also specify who is going to deliver her or do the pick ups from BF house EOW to BM house?
The contract looks good to me and she would be foolish not to sign it. However, in my state the judge will not allow a parent to walk away from their responsibility for CS. Time and time again I have seen it sent back because it said no CS and the judge would not sign it.

northernsiren's picture

but you are absolutely right, it SHOULD say where the pick ups and drop offs will be. I thought it was implied, but with something like this, it needs to be specific!!!

I am hoping that the CS will get through as is, it will simply things greatly...

"Insanity: doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results." Albert Einstein

Sita Tara's picture

We won custody from BM. Rather that is to say, she caved in 4pm on the night before our trial date (which only came after 4 PRE-trials over 9 months. They started out with shared (joint.)So, I have a little experience here.

I know laws vary from state to state. I think it's good you have the things you want in mind going in, but I believe all you should do in the beginning is file for modify/change current custody. For instance since ours was shared parenting to start, we filed a request to modify/terminate the shared parenting agreement. We also asked for a GAL to be appointed for SD, and a psych evaluation for BM, volunteering to take one ourselves as well.

That's basically all that initial filing said.

Then began the long arduous process of GAL interviews, pre-trial after pre-trial, court ordered high conflict parent coordination (fancy term for mediation for people who can't collaborate) etc.

Your SD will have to be strong enough to tell the GAL (and a counselor wouldn't hurt) what is going on and where she would like to be.

We never got into the nitty gritty of what we wanted or how the terms were to work. I think that only happens in initial custody hearings if the parties can't agree from the beginning.

Even when it was obvious we would win, the psychologist asked SD what her ideal visitation schedule was, and the psychologist discussed this with the GAL, who also talked with SD to confirm her wishes. The GALs recommendations were what BM agreed to, the court blessed and if we would have challenged that the whole thing could have fallen through.

It took forever. And I have to caution you since your DH doesn't have shared/joint custody, it's a lot harder to tip the scale. How our attorney put it, was that we were in a much better position trying to go from shared to full. We only had to prove that we were better able to serve SD's best interests. If we were NCPs, we would have to prove BM unfit, which is a lot more scale to tip.

You must above all else remember this is a very slow, tedious process. I often feel the court just drags its own feet until the parties agree, change their minds, or run out of money.

So... DOCUMENT everything. Keep tons of notes. When talking with to a GAL or anyone associated with the case, make sure you are always the rational side, always cooperate with all the hoops the court makes you jump through. Allow BM to be the one who refuses to cooperate. And if you are putting anything in writing, continue to do like you did above. Make several drafts, vent it all out in the first, and each additional draft make it less emotional until finally your perspective is gone from it, and you are left with facts only. Then ask one of us to read it again!!! before you send it.

GOODLUCK!!!!

"Om Tare Tutare Ture Mama Ayurpunye Jnana Putin Kuru Svaha"
~Sita Tara Mantra

northernsiren's picture

since BM won't have a lawyer, I hope some of this won't be necessary. BM has run out of money before we've even started, and given her family is funding our lawsuit, there will be no relief there. We are hoping she will just sign off on it as is, if it's uncontested, do we really have to jump through all these hoops?

The lawyer we spoke to seemed pretty positive about the whole thing, given SD's age. BM has brought it up repeatedly to have us take SD, and then she backpedals. We hope that faced with the issue of a lawsuit, she'll just fold and sign. I hope that proves to be the case. I have a log of all the things dating back over a year ago that have happened in relation to BM failing to provide for SD. THAT will definitely need to be purged of judgment and anger before being sent along to anyone, just the facts ma'am is hard when you care....

"Insanity: doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results." Albert Einstein

Sita Tara's picture

But our lawyer was pretty adamant that it be included. And after all was said and done I'm glad he did. This woman will likely put up a stink regardless of CS, as it seems she is just about maintaining control over SD and keeping her as her own personal servant. So I would not even mention it, and let the courts bring it up later as it is necessary to address. But yes, in our initial filing, our attorney added that DH was requesting a change in CS, whatever amount he would be due per the court's decision on custody. Then we didn't mention money ever again to anyone- GAL, or psychologist.

BUT Boy BM sure did. She told everyone repeatedly that DH was just trying to get out of paying her CS. But because we never mentioned it past the initial filing, and only then as a sort of side note, BM's fixation on bringing it up only further illustrated that she was the one who didn't want to pay toward the upbringing of her child.

Keep us posted!

"Om Tare Tutare Ture Mama Ayurpunye Jnana Putin Kuru Svaha"
~Sita Tara Mantra

northernsiren's picture

It's all she cares about, not once in this last go around did she mention visitation of SD, or her school, her friends, nothing. All she was focused on was getting FH to sign something saying he'd never go after her for CS.

I hope with having the grandparents in our court, that will go along way to defusing the "he just doesn't want to pay CS" argument. Here's two people, with no motivation other than loving their grandchild, trying to get her placed with us, and offering to pay US CS (we would never take it, but that's the extent that they care) just to get her out of BM's house.

Hopefully that will get the court's attention....

"Insanity: doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results." Albert Einstein

Rags's picture

For the drop-off section I would notify that each party is responsible to get the child to their location. That way BM will have to make the effort to pick SD up. At the girls age she can be left alone for the WE and BM will not have to plan to get SD and spend time with her if your DH just drops SD off.

The agreement looks great otherwise.

As for CS, the Judge may not allow a $0.00 CS level so be ready for the Judge to potentially throw a wrench in as far as CS is concerned.

Just my thoughts of course.

Best regards,

northernsiren's picture

I'm fine with the court stating she needs to pay CS, we want to go in saying that it doesn't matter at all, which it doesn't, it's not about money for us. We will accept a dollar a month if that makes it easier, we don't care. I expect her to fight over the 50% of unreimbursed medical expenses, I have no doubt she will.

I will mention that stipulation to FH regarding the drop off. We wrote it that way b/c he drives in that direction to go to work on Saturdays. But you're right, if she actually had to get up off her butt to get SD on Sat, she probably won't do it, and it will be easier to deal with SD being left at her full time house than for us to be dealing with BM refusing to bring her back on Sun...

"Insanity: doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results." Albert Einstein

bellacita's picture

as i read ur IP i was going to suggest that. usually, the parent starting visitation is responsible for transportation and it makes sense for a number of reasons.
if shes late getting her, she loses time instead of issues arising bc maybe FH is stuck in traffic or whatever. and like u said, if she decides not to exercise, which no doubt this LOSER will, then FH doesnt run the risk of dropping SD off, no one being home, having to drive back to drop her off w u and being late for work. PLUS, i dont care if BM lives NEXT door to where FH works, dont do any favors for her! u are not here to make HER life easier!!

i would still put in about bdays...BM may not care to have SD on hers, but FH probably would and so this makes it nice. i like ur holiday schedule--BASIC AND ROTATING. very important imo. i dont see any need to rotate holidays like MLK day and other bank holidays that alot of times are built in.

i think sita may be rite about the motion to modify, but i think when u file that motion, u can just put all of this in as what u want the modification to be. if BM agrees, then i think its done BUT if not, THEN u will go thru the steps sita listed above. u will have to put in the reason for the mod, and in this case, neglect and abuse may warrant ALOT more than the judge just signing off. in our case, BM filed a motion to modify based on claiming abuse. DH answered refuting EVERY claim she had at which point her lawyer suggested mediation. once the abuse claim is made they will not just throw anything out.

so, as others said above, its likely the judge wont allow for no CS. CS is an OBLIGATION and its separate from visitation. i know what u are trying to do, i just dont know if it can be done so easily.

"Given the right reasons and the right two people, marriage is a wonderful way of experiencing your life."
~the late great George Carlin

northernsiren's picture

FH says BM is going to complain that 10:00 am is "too early" to get two small children up and out of the house to pick up SD. My response is fine, she can come get her later, the agreement says she will HAVE ACCESS to her, not that if she's incapable of getting motivated by 10:00 am we will pick up the slack. Either that or we can have the visitation start Friday evening, however I am concerned a. about SD having time for friends and b. having time for homework, so I figured Friday nights and Sat mornings would be good for those two things, plus she will have time Sunday after she gets home to work on homework as well.

SD's birthday is listed on the holiday list, says we get her unless her birthday is on a scheduled BM visitation day.

I am discouraged around the CS point, I don't see why the court would want to instigate a fight, especially since she doesn't work. Would a token, like $50.00 a month be sufficient to avoid this? School lunch for SD comes to $55.00 per month, maybe that would suffice?

As always, thanks for your input Bella!

"Insanity: doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results." Albert Einstein

bellacita's picture

missed u too! gosh i go away for 6 days and come back to a ST shit storm...i see ALOT has gone on and im so sad i couldnt help all my friends in there times of need. Sad

anyway, on to u...what about fri eve pickups then? ours start after work fri and SD is returned early sun am. i know some like fri and some sat to start visitation, but fri eve IS an option. AND PLUS, it may be better to get her back earlier on sun since im assuming she WILL need transition time from the mess that is BMs house.

Bdays i meant BMs and FHs...either way, even w just SDs bday, i think what u meant to say is FH gets her on her BD regardless of whether its BMs day or not...thats usually how holidays work...they take precedence.

heres the thing about CS: the NCP HAS to pay it...bottom line. so i think regardless of what is settled w visitation, a judge would demand it from her. for us, DH had been paying her an agreed upon amount since the split and it was in the papers...BUT as soon as everything went to court regarding VISITATION ONLY, the GAL said CS would be recalculated, go rite by the book and be garnished. a slap in the face bc he had always paid his cs and even though DH was in the process of setting it up thru the courts since he didnt want any "wheres my cs check, im coming to get it" texts, it worked out.

so i know youve had alot on ur plate...i read the xmas posts...BM is a cow. SDs persents from her?? i spent more on my freakin DOG, but then again, i adore tha littel sweetheart. but have u gotten any further w wedding plans???

"Given the right reasons and the right two people, marriage is a wonderful way of experiencing your life."
~the late great George Carlin

northernsiren's picture

They both got laser toys in their stockings, plus these squeaker mice things that the little one especially loves (awww look how cute he's pretending to torture a small animal!) Wink But like you and your doggie, I love my cats, so it wasn't exactly a stretch...

So you had a good time with family I trust???

I guess with it only being every other weekend, it doesn't much matter the specifics of drop offs and pick ups, namely time and by whom. I'm not elated about the idea of getting up and at em Sunday morning to pick up SD, it's the only day FH doesn't work, so I think noon might work out okay. When we get to that point, I'll ask SD what she thinks will work best.

I also was toying with the idea of drafting a contract for SD and us with regard to coming and living here. I know she's lived with so much uncertainty at BMs, with nothing she does being right or good enough, and being let down so often. I wanted to outline in writing, what we promise to do for her, what her rewards will be for a job well done, and her punishments, and I want to outline her responsibilities to us, clearly, concisely. FH and are talked about it over the weekend and I am sick to death of hearing about SD being punished. I REALLY don't want to live like that, constantly finding fault with what she does, or looking over her shoulder for things that are wrong. She will have chores, and if she doesn't do them, or do them properly, she doesn't get her allowance. I'm even going to write up a list of all that goes on in the house to keep it nice, and allow her to PICK her responsibilities that earn her her allowance. Basically the single most important thing, her job, is to get good grades. As long as her grades are up, she has the right to do sports, clubs, visit with friends, have friends over, everything and we will do everything we can to support her in doing that. But the minute her grades are slipping, those things go on hold. We've said a lot of this to her, but I think maybe it might mean more as a document for us all to have.

RE the CS, I had heard that especially b/c she has the small children, it was unlikely we would be able to get awarded CS. That doesn't seem fair, I mean, it's not SD's fault Bm decided to spawn more troll babies, but b/c of that, SD gets no support? And since BM won't be working, we WILL have to be harrassing her for any CS money directly, and I don't want to do that...

I planned THEE perfect wedding bella, and was so so so disappointed when the ceremony site wouldn't allow us to do it in October, and FH won't push the date to September. Blah!!! I have the honeymoon just about set though, and that's been lovely, I spent so much time plotting it, it gives me the most wonderful dreams of the caribbean sea almost every night!!! Dirol

"Insanity: doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results." Albert Einstein

bellacita's picture

i have caribbean honeymoom ideas....ever been to a sandals resort??? ultra romantic, all inclusive and super affordable!! go go GO!!!

i dont think thats rite for cs...maybe bc she doesnt work but her having more kids would reduce her cs slightly, but not cut it out completely. when DH and i have a baby, (hopefully soon!!! keep those fingers crossed!) CS will go down by like 3% or something ungodly. ur "new" family doesnt get u out of teh obligation to the "first" family remember.

i think a contract is an AWESOME idea! it will help her to feel stable too. gosh, u really are an amazing stepMOM!!!!!!!!!!!!

"Given the right reasons and the right two people, marriage is a wonderful way of experiencing your life."
~the late great George Carlin

northernsiren's picture

I just hope the contract thing isn't too hokey. I just thought about it in the terms I mentioned, plus in thinking so much about the custody agreement, all the nitty gritty details surrounding the lousy BM's visitation, what about the nitty gritties that really matter, the huge changes in SD's life. I think her adjustment shouldn't be too difficult, she's going from a very tough chaotic situation to a stable, calm home, but I do think that change in and of itself is scary, and having some framework to ease into will make it better for her, and for us. I am mostly worried about BM playing the guilt card heavily on SD. "You don't love me or your little sisters" or refusing to take her for visitation or saying "it's your fault we're going to lose the house" or things like that once BM loses FH's CS payment. I have already made it clear to FH that no matter what the outcome, SD is going to need to see a therapist. She needs someone to talk to where she can truly express how she feels and not risk hurting or alienating the person, or being punished.

And you're too kind, really, I'm just trying to do things right for a girl who's had a very rough shake of it. My relationship with my dad meant the world to me, and it still does, so I will do whatever I can to celebrate and support FH's relationship with SD. She makes it easy, by being a good kid...

"Insanity: doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results." Albert Einstein

Sia's picture

but I will add that you should not assume anything to be understood....spell everything out...that way there are no loop holes for her butt to jump through.

northernsiren's picture

"on the other hand, this usually triggers the knee jerk reaction in the bio mom to take back custody just so she doesn't have to pay CS and that he does"

This is EXACTLY what will happen. Her head will spin at the notion of losing the CS income, basically, since next to none of it goes directly to supporting SD, this is money out of their household budget. That, PLUS another expense, of having to pay CS, will ensure her not cooperating.

We can't put SD through fighting over such a paltry sum of money, and I fully agree, on principle she should have to pay, but meanwhile, SD is living in fear of being hit, plus being emotionally and psychologically abused by her mom. I can't stand to see a child be abused on principle. It's just not right. If there's anything we can do to move things along as fast as possible, we'll have to do it. I feel like insisting on the CS makes it just that, a shell game for cash and it's not about that at all, the cleaner this cut can be, the better...

"Insanity: doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results." Albert Einstein

northernsiren's picture

that seemed to be her big concern, that FH agree to NEVER go after her for CS. At one point, she said if he'd sign something saying that, she'd sign over SD. She's already told both SD and FH that SD is out of the house when she turns 18, basically when the CS payments stop, she's out. It's ALL about the money here, and just the insane ravings of a domineering b*tch. B

But in all seriousness, how would she pay even a paltry sum? She doesn't have a job. Her hubby would have to pay it and he's made it abundantly clear he won't. So the BM will have to get a job? She won't, b/c she has no one to care for the spawn and she just flat out does not care enough about SD to do it....

"Insanity: doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results." Albert Einstein

northernsiren's picture

BM actually said in this last exchange "if I win the lottery Sd isn't entitled to any of my money anyway". I don't even understand why anyone was wasting breath on this subject, like THAT is ever going to happen.

The medical was the biggest thing, and I put the clause in there about 50% unreimbursed medical expenses, for exactly that reason. FH has already paid for ALL of the braces expenses that it has cost for SD to have braces on for the last 6 YEARS!!!! THAT is going to stop once she lives with us, BM can at least kick in 50%, though again, I feel like it's kind of a blood/stone issue. I don't know how we're going to get money from her that does not exist, and it seems like more of a hassle than it's worth to file to have her put in contempt when she doesn't pay, pay the lawyer MORE money to pursue it, etc.

"Insanity: doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results." Albert Einstein

lollipopgirlz's picture

I would put something in it about how old when child support ends....18 or college aged and also address the issue of college tuition ...things do change. Make it clear that you will still claim deductions while they are in college etc...you will have to fill out fafsa forms etc and i'm sure she isn't going to pay for school but you might want to put in there something that both parents will attempt to split tuition if possible.