Hope this is in the right area. HOW do you totally disengage?
I'm still new here, but not so-so new to being a SM. DH & I have been together going on 6 yrs and progressively its getting harder and harder when SD is visiting (every other weekend generally). SD pulled away from me big time in the last couple yrs and has put a divider and now treats me like we're in competition for DH when she's here. I want to disengage.
Now I have kids too and together DH & I share a DS and have another on the way due in Oct. So I can't really disengage 100% when SD is here because sometimes the kids play and sometimes they don't. But put it in black and white for me everyone, HOW do you disengage and keep peace with DH? I've tried talking to him, he understands my frustrations but of course he's hurt that SD and I aren't busom buddies. Any helpful input is GREATLY appreciated. We're working so hard to stick together on these issues and its wearing on both of us and I feel like that is a small win for his ex since she'd love nothing more than for us to crumble apart (misery loves company and BOY is she MISERABLE lol)
Thanks!
Sometimes you can't disengage
Sometimes you can't disengage and keep peace with DH. I did it very gradually over several years and did NOT announce to DH I was doing it. The latter is a big no no because they get all defensive over it. Try just gradually having less input to the parenting of SD and refer her to her Dad more and more. This might work.
Over a period of years my DH has accepted my total disengagement from his daughters and that I do not care for their attitudes and behaviour. It was not an easy road, though.
I'm no expert since I am
I'm no expert since I am "patially disengaged". One thing I think you should do is give your husband a head's up on what it is you plan to do. Some spouses see disengaging as form of retaliation. It isn't. Disengaging means you are simply protecting yourself emotionally. By not shouldering any responsibility of your step-child, you cannot be made to be the bad guy should things fail. You take no interest in how these step-kids turn out as people. In my case, I have disengaged from SS in the evenings. After he is supposed to be in bed, I just pretend that he is not there. If my DW lets him stay up past his bed time, that's her problem, I let her deal with it. The other day DW asked me if SS had turned in. I knew he was still up but I replied with a "I don't know, why don't you go look?". In this manner I am abolving myself of all responsibilities and I am not rating out SS either.
I will respectfully disagree
I will respectfully disagree with Kes in regards to definitely not letting DH know what you're doing. You should judge and determine whether your spouse will deal better with it knowing beforehand, or figuring it out on his own. I decided to tell DH what my plans were, and explaining my reasons. I did this without blame, argument, etc. I simply told him that I wasn't going to allow SD and her behavior cause problems between him and I anymore. I told him that I was tired of being disrespected in my home. I explained to him that we have a duty to ourselves to preserve our marriage so that, when the kids are all gone, we still like each other, and that the only way I see to do that is by me disengaging from SD. We had a huge fight every time I spoke to her above a whiny whisper. I explained that he cannot expect me to treat her like she's my daughter when it comes to the fun and good things, and not allow me to parent her when it comes to demanding respect and correcting her, so I wasn't going to do any of it. He balked at first but understood where I was coming from. I knew this was the best way to deal with MY DH. Only you know how best to approach your DH, if at all, regarding this.
It's too late to keep
It's too late to keep anything from DH anyway, we've always practiced a "speak your mind even if it hurts" mentality in our marriage, but always with respect. DH knows that I find weekends with SD very difficult now and while he tries to discuss and we make a plan to stick together for the next weekend its like once she's here his blinders are on and he doesn't want to hurt her/piss her off or whatever the case may be. But its like a cycle ever.frickin.weekend. lol But no, I dont' agree to keep it secret, I'm just wondering if this is whats its about, slowing backing off and caring less in a way? I feel bad, but I feel worse when I loathe the weekend coming up knowing she's visiting and I don't look forward to it.
In my case, I felt bad at
In my case, I felt bad at first but now, only about a month or so later, I feel good about it. Actually, SD and I get along a little better because she doesn't give me attitude, DH and I get along better because we're not fighting about SD. (Part of my disengaging was also not expressing my opinion or giving advice to DH about SD).
I do admit to be VERY passive
I do admit to be VERY passive when DH asks my opinion about stuff concerning SD. He has taken notice and I just flat out told him "she's your DD you make those decisions not me" and he doesn't like that so he IS trying to make changes, it's just that he needs to get his head out of the clouds when she's here and stop acting like she does no wrong and he isn't over-disciplining the other kids when that is exactly what he's doing.
no, not happily. But DH
no, not happily. But DH doesn't admit he sees how SD treats me by ignoring my requests etc and not viewing me as an adult in the household and constantly over stepping me by going to DH for stuff. He just wants it to be easier LOL And of course its not that easy. So while he isn't HAPPY with the decision, he DOES say he understands why I'm feeling the need to pull back and "care less" so to speak. Does that make sense? I find it ALL too easy to shut down and stop talking to DH when I'm angry and unhappy about how a weekend with SD has gone. But that gets us NO where fast and always results in more arguing and then before we know it its another weekend time with SD and the cycle is vicious. So I always want to maintain some neutral ground with DH so it never becomes a wedge because honestly that would be a dream to SD if DH & I broke up and she could have him all to herself again. Not to mention the gloating sheer joy his ex would feel to see his life fall apart (like her's has since she's so miserable).
Yes, I guess partially
Yes, I guess partially disengage is more appropriate. SD is 12 and my kids are 10 / 8 & 7. When SD is here, she's very passive aggressive and doesn't listen to me unless I raise my voice or say things like "_____ I asked all kids to play outside before dinner, that means you too". She will often ask "Where's my dad?" if I ask something of her, or give an answer she isn't happy with. She wants to confer with DH to get an answer more suitable to her favour. DH & I have extensively talked about this and while we agree to be on the same page prior to her visits, once SD is here, its an entirely different story. DH almost goes into micro manage mode on my kids, like he's trying to show loyalty to SD that he doesn't favour them above her. He will bitch them out for small stuff in front of SD and you can just see the pleasure it gives her. So really, my problem isn't with SD persay (although I really don't appreciate her lack of respect, I also get that she's a pre-teen blah blah blah) but I'm wondering and hoping that by disengageing a bit DH will wake up and see I'm serious. If he can't be fair to all the kids when SD is around, it will make for a very, very miserable atmosphere once SD goes back home. So I've stopped including SD in plans, if my kids are invited to playdates I've stopped working it so SD is included also. It is what it is. As a result she's been bored some weekends as all the other kids have plans except her. I've stopped encouraging her to phone her cousin who lives in our town to make plans prior to her coming to visit us but she lements that she's too busy. So be it. I don't make the plans for her. I know its hurting DH to see SD sad and lonely. It hurts me too but I just don't know what to do anymore! She quite has the attitude that we should cater to her on weekends she's here and she can be very emotionally manipulative with DH. Onve she's gone, its like we're back at square one discussing what needs to change, what we can do to make next weekend better etc etc but once she's back its like our conversation never happened!
I can relate. I've had to
I can relate. I've had to ask DH not to tell SD when DD gets punished as SD gloats about it and reminds DD of it incessantly. I've also told my DH if he were the parent to SD that he is to my kid then we wouldn't have the problems we have with her.
this is EXACTLY it. DH will
this is EXACTLY it. DH will give my kids shit over the silliest thing, MEANWHILE SD is doing the same exact thing and he just doesn't see it!! So my kids are always looking like they're in trouble all.the.time and SD just soaks it all up. Last summer while out camping my DS & DD went to play and wandered into an area my DH & I hadn't OK'd for the kids to play in. There was a small time frame of panic finding them and all SD had to say was "How much trouble are they in? Will they get into trouble when you find them?" and I was furious that she couldn't wait to witness their fate. So I made sure to let DH know that we would discuss it in private with the kids and not in front of SD.
That's actually one of my new rule requests is that DH really reign in his parenting of my kids when SD visits and see if there is less tension. Because I know it really rubs me the wrong way when I have to watch DH discipline my kids and not notice what SD is doing meanwhile. So it will be our new tactic this upcoming weekend when she's here.
But that's exactly right. I asked DH "If you're going to discipline and be that hard on my kids, do the same for SD so there's continuity and she doesn't see the favoritism." He doesn't see it that way so instead I've asked him to step down and feel free to fully focus his attention on SD when she's here and leave ALL the disciplining of my kids to ME when she's here. I don't want to confuse the other kids or set bad examples but I can't stand to watch SD gloat over something like that, it's disgusting. If DH can extend privacy to talk with SD about what she does wrong he should do the same for the other kids and stop embarrassing them in front of SD. FAIRNESS PEOPLE it's ALL I ask for!! LOL
I forgot to add details about
I forgot to add details about my disengaging attempts. I do still speak to SD when she's around, unless she's being a little b@#!*. If she speaks to me I will respond in like. I DO NOT do anything for her. I am a cake decorator and, in the past, have made cakes for SD and DD for any school event, special occasion, BDay, etc. I don't do that for SD anymore and the times she's asked I've just told her "no". If she asks me to take her somewhere or if she can do something I tell her to ask her dad. I don't buy her special groceries/shampoo/etc. She will use what we have at the house or her dad will buy it for her. I do fix dinner for her when she's there, only because I fix dinner for everyone, and she never complains about what I cook. Basically I do nothing for her, don't ask her to do anything, and don't correct her when she's being a brat. I leave all of that to husband.
OK, your examples are very
OK, your examples are very similar to things I've already done so I guess it's naturally happening unbeknownst to me. I used to buy specific stuff for SD on weekends she'd visit. And no, I didn't expect her to fall over herself with gratitude, but never a thanks or anything in my direction. Like I'm not worth the effort. As if my purpose is to care for her since she is, after all, DH's DD and I am, after all, his wife like its expected, no longer a treat/etc. So I stopped seeking out her favourites. I used to let her bring home made stuff back with her so she'd have some of her own but she is so naturally selfish anyway I stopped allowing her to take things home with her simply because she didn't like sharing with the other kids and preferred to have stuff all to herself. She only comes to me if she wants something. So I tell her to ask dad (DH & I already have an agreement that kids are not to play one parent over the other so whatever she asks him anyway he will confer with me first but If eel like its letting SD know that if all I'm good for is doing stuff for her/buying stuff for her then she can go to her dad and not me). When I buy the other kids new clothes etc and SD asks if she's getting new things as well I tell her honestly that I can't afford to buy for her too since she has her mom and dad to buy her things but my kids have just me to buy their things (I don't have an ex, their dad passed away when they were small). Is this too harsh? I felt it put it bluntly to her that I'm good for more than just buying her stuff and that her expectations of my usefulness aren't realistic. Sometimes DH things I'm TOO honest/blunt with her. But sometimes I feel like he glosses over too much and that SD is old enough to know how some stuff works and the realities of the situation and not sugar coat everything since she already things the sun rises and sets on her mom. OK now I'm venting LOL
Google it here on this site.
Google it here on this site. There was a long post very recently, and many others that you may find helpful.
oh I didn't know about that,
oh I didn't know about that, thank you! I'm off to read. I'm really enjoying the "escape" this forum/site provides. I wouldn't be surprised if DH joined too (if he was computer savvy that is LOL) such a relief to have a vent zone to bounce stuff off about things.
WOW. that is a tuff situation
WOW. that is a tuff situation and I would like to say I'd do the same thing but I know myself better and would guilt myself into doing her laundry etc LOL But good on you!
"I did it to stop putting myself in rejecting situations" this really struck a cord with me as it's exactly right. While my SD is younger and I think a lot of it is to do with her personality and how she's being raised she really seems ignorant to when she hurts people's feelings and if you point it out to her point blank she'll just look at you confused and say "I don't understand what you mean". Like she REALLY doesn't understand or "get" that she's rude, abrasive and her passive aggressive behaviour is unpleasant. She's very stand offish and doesn't think of anyone but herself at all times. It would NEVER occur to her to put anyone or anything above her own needs EVER.
I have gone so far as to purposely leave SD's favourite groceries off the list when I shop for weekends she'll be here. And she does have a few dislikes when it comes to meals I like but the rest of the family likes them so I definitely make them when she's here regardless and never cater to her anymore. She is definitely jealous of my kids and all that they have. No matter what SD gets, if my kids get something she wants it too. She went so far as to ask DH to get a pet since "all the other kids have one, its not fair" and thankfully DH told her no, since she didn't live with us she wouldn't be the one caring for the pet therefore it wouldn't really be hers.
My situation (so far) isn't as extreme as how your SD treated you but I imagine in the years to come SD will come up with some new tricks. She is also HEAVILY influenced by her manipulative medling mother too which makes stuff extra fun
I treated SS like I was a
I treated SS like I was a friendly Aunt. BTW...congrats on only having her EOWE!! It will make it a lot easier.
I really did nothing for SS. No laundry, dishes ect. I only fed him if I cooked for everyone. I NEVER requested anything of SS. That was DH's job.
If SS left dirty dishes out, I would tell DH to please go put away SS's dishes. And either he did or he got SS to do it. ECT. If SS broke curfew, it was not my problem. If SS was flunking, I stayed out of it.
DH probably needs to do the same with your kids when SD is there also.
You are too funny! Yes, I'm
You are too funny! Yes, I'm glad it's only every second weekend (generally, but sometimes we skip a weekend if her mom signs her up for something that falls on DH's weekend.) We also used to get her 6 weeks in summer but again, her mother signed her up for something that will interrupt that as well. I'm not heartbroken but I DO feel sad for DH as its out of his control. I will say I'm HAPPY that it will mean SD doesn't attend out annual family road trip this year since her activities will overlap with the trip and for the FIRST TIME EVER I put my foot down and told DH we were not re-scheduling or juggling to accommodate so SD can come. She can know that choices she makes may result in missing out on stuff now and again. MY kids have to learn stuff like that, why should SD be coddled and catered to just because her parents are divorced? I've never pulled the "give my kids special treatment their dad died years ago blah blah". This was a big shock to SD and while it may please DH's ex that SD isn't coming with us, it DOES shine a new light for SD to realize her mother is the reason she's not attending the trip with us this year since it was her insistence on signing her up for stuff with out giving DH the dates until it was "too late". Sorry, I kind of ranted off topic there LOL
And I've actually REQUESTED of my DH to let me parent my kids when SD is here on weekends and that DH should give full attention to SD. That way she isn't reveling in any instance they get into trouble or DH starts micro managing, it really feels like a win/win. I'll soon find out since SD comes this weekend and we'll be trying out this "new rule" for the first time.
Disengaging is easier than
Disengaging is easier than you think. Follow these simple steps:
1. Take a deep breath.
2. Say to yourself, "I'm mad as hell, and I'm not going to take it anymore!"
3. Pretend like skid doesn't exist.
I know that #3 sounds harsh, but I firmly believe that you have to go all the way with disengaging for it to work. I also would not announce my intentions, either. In my case, my DW very quickly figured out what was happening, and did not care at all since there was no longer any discord involving SD (DW is a card-carrying "friend" parent who avoids conflict with her children at all costs).
There are a couple of things to consider. I wouldn't call them "exceptions" to disengaging, more like boundaries that allow you to create the safe space from which you disengage:
1. It's ok to talk to your spouse about the skid if the issue is something that threatens to solvency of the family, such as a drug habit, dating gang-bangers, trying to move back home, etc.
2. It's ok to tacitly allow your spouse "skid time," where it is just the two (or more) of them. Read a book, watch TV, whatever - just don't get involved in their activity.
My life got much simpler - and happier - when I disengaged. If you have found the need to post on this forum, then you are probably in a difficult, unhappy situation, so I highly recommend disengaging.
I fully encourage and support
I fully encourage and support DH spending one-on-one time with SD as jealousy is a huge issue with her (she's only known the life of an only child and introducing my kids was very, very hard on her and still is) but its actually my DH who insists he involve my kids too to show his DD that its not all about her anymore and she can like it or leave it. I think he would love to see SD choose him over her mom and of course that will never happen. So DH tries to create situations where SD is forced to see his new life and reality and make a choice but she refuses. She just gets more jealous and her mom feeds into it and coddles her about how awful we are for not revolving life around her the way she thinks we should.
I'm definitely getting more ideas on how to (gently) disengage in my case as I do worry that DH will be so hurt he'll retaliate by announcing he's disengaging from my kids (who live with us full time). I'm trying to be sensitive to him at the same time letting it be clear that I insist I be comfortable in my own home first and foremost and that if it came down to him choose his DD's comfort over negotiating working a happy medium out with me, I would walk out without hesitation. But DH really IS trying to work as he knows his DD is difficult and he happily blames his ex for e.v.e.r.y.t.h.i.n.g. and don't get me wrong, his ex is horrid simply AWFUL. But SD is 12 going on 13 and has to be accountable for herself to SOME extent and DH just too easily blames her mother for everything and doesn't think SD is at fault for any of it.
From the beginning of our
From the beginning of our relationship, SD-12 made our lives hell. Demanding, manipulative, controlling and just outright hostile.
She now lives fulltime with BM and visits every 2nd weekend. DH has stepped up to the plate and takes care of ALL the discipline, cooking, cleaning etc when she comes over. SS-11 is a great child who helps out, is friendly, outgoing and an all around great kid. He has no problem keeping his room tidy, listening to his Father and joining in with BBQ's etc. DH stays on SD's case when she comes over - to make sure she cleans her room etc. I help him with doing the cooking, salads etc. We both get all the kids to help with the cleaning up (my DS-14, SD-12 and SS-11).
I take care of the discplining of my child, while DH takes care of his.
This has worked out pretty well for us. Oh - and if SD has an attitude, then she's not allowed over - period.
Maybe it would work in your case - your DH takes care of his own and you take care of yours. Otherwise, DH will have to stand up and support you in EVERY decision to do with her. He has to show her that you and him are a united front and that he puts YOU first as his priority, while still being sure he takes care of his responsibilities i.e. his kids.
and if "SD has an attitude,
and if "SD has an attitude, then she's not allowed over - period."
I wish my DH would follow through with this. SD at age 12 going on 13 can be so bitchy to DH when he calls her and the snot attitude is unreal. My kids would never get away without a tongue lashing at the very least but SD does it often and I would LOVE if DH just told her "you can stay home this weekend if you're going to have that attitude with me" but he feels guilty and doesn't want to miss the weekend with her which I totally get, but come on! SD just pulls the dough-eyed "what did I do?" ploy and DH smooths it over with comments like "I'm sure it was because her mother was in the room listening in and so she was putting on a show". Uhhh so what? So teach her that it won't be tolerated regardless if she's trying to impress her mom or not. This is a point of contention between us too with regards to SD. It doesn't happy every weekend, but often enough to point out that he needs to stand up and stop letting his 12 YEAR OLD parent HIM.
This weekend we are adopting the roles of "while SD is here you take care of yours and I'll take care of mine." This won't extend to things like if we go out I pay for mine he pays for his but it WILL contend with discipline issues. SD gets away with everything because DH is always making himself too busy micro managing my kids to notice and SD gets an eye full every weekend of my kids getting in trouble while she skips through the weekend doing whatever she wants
this article helped me
this article helped me http://www.steptogether.org/disengaging.html
I cannot fully disengage because SD1 (10.5 going on 15) is in my home 100%, but I have made it clear I am supervising her and most of everything else is her dad's responsibility (appointments, after school transportation, extracurricular activities, sports, medical appointments, etc.).
I will go with him to these activities and appointments, but it is not my responsibility anymore and I stopped doing all the extra hidden things moms do behind the scenes on a daily basis for their kids.
Some days if she has mistreated me badly, I don't cook for her & its her dads responsibility to make sure she is fed.
I found the more I did the more my SO dumped on me and I was expected to do it all and SD1 didn't even give a crap.
Well now she has missed practice, a game, a party and a couple outings because my SO flat out forgot to make arrangements - I didn't remind him either.