SD 20 & 23 failure to launch...or even start engines

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We have been blended for 7 years - I have two BS: 16 & 12, 2 SD: 23 & 20 (all 4 have been with us full time for 5 years - before that we were 50/50). SS24 moved out 2 years ago (last year he started renting an apartment with his mother who is bipolar). DH wishes he just stayed home, living with us.

The girls (23 & 20) have had short-lived, part time jobs in the past and finished High School (reluctantly, but they did it - that is how/why we got full custody - bio mom was okay with them dropping out, DH stepped in and said, "No. Come live with me and graduate." And they did.), so I know they are both capable when expectations are set and consequences are enforced. That said, DH is a bit old fashioned and does not think it is necessary for his daughters to work if they both want to be stay-at-home moms; he is also okay with them living at home until they get married. I knew some of this going into our marriage. What I did not realize, is how disconnected from life outside of the home, both girls would become. How will they find partners to support their goals of being stay-at-home moms if they do not talk to anyone outside of the family and they do not have jobs/go to school to meet people?

SD20 had her heart broken last year by her high school boyfriend, she was very depressed, she lost weight and withdrew from the few friends she had. She is getting better now, but the walls are up. SD23 does not have a single friend outside of the family. Neither of them talk to anyone online, they are not on social media for connection, they are borderline agoraphobic in my opinion; however the 3 bio siblings are very close and spend time going to movies, talking on the phone, hanging out together and are trying to rebuild relations with their mother.

My SDs are polite and respectful; they do the chores their dad expects them to do (their laundry, clean their rooms/bathroom and pick up after themselves). They never ask for money, they both have savings accounts with several thousands (they save all gift money, grad money etc.) they are not expected to pay for their phones, rent, food, insurance etc. Their dad covers all expenses and is not concerned about it. He feels they are emotionally stunted from situations involving their mother as well as the toll the pandemic took on their outlook and options. DH wants them protected and would like them both to find something they want to do on their own time.

I do not agree with my SDs’ choices or my DH’s parenting, but feel I have to accept and respect them. I have different values for myself and my two BS (16 & 12). My sons each participate in 3 sports (one each season), they both go to school and have large social circles. The girls get uncomfortable when my sons have friends over, they stay in their rooms and will not come out until everyone is gone. My sons do not complain about their stepsisters, they seem to feel bad for them.

It is like we are two families living under one roof. I used to think of it as a season, but now I think this is how it is going to be and I’m not sure I have any options. We decided at the beginning that the bio parent would have final say for their kids. I do not think of my SDs as kids, I think of them as young women, failing to thrive in life. I am concerned they are not developing the skills needed for them to succeed outside of our house and no one seems to care, but me. I have always believed a stepparent cannot care more than the bio parent and now I am confronted by living with two roommates I would not have chosen. I love my marriage and do not want it to suffer because of my pent up resentments. I am afraid my sons will move out before my stepdaughters and my DH is willing to sacrifice the much needed discomforts that help young adults grow for the protections of having them remain under his roof, away from the scary world. When I bring up my concerns, they are dismissed with comments from DH like, "You just want to push them out of the house, they are in their rooms and not in your way. What difference does it make? I don't want to lose them."

I just want what is best for my whole family, SDs, my marriage and my sons. My expectation is that both SD should be in school, or working or if their mental instability is getting in the way of that, they should each be in counseling working toward launching.

I agree with you but...

I agree with everything you say but if your DH disagrees, your options are limited. I'm sad for the "girls". Your DH is old fashioned.

If they are so damn

If they are so damn traditional and old-fashioned, do they at least go to church? That's probably their best bet for finding guys willing to take them off their dad's hands and support them completely. I would have a serious talk with DH about a time limit. Is he willing to let them sit in their rooms until their 40s? Jesus.

ETA do you work? If so, maybe these traditional homemakers-in-training need to take over all the homemaking. Cleaning, yardwork, cooking, etc. Also ETA their own laundry, and cleaning up after themselves are middle-school level chores. I respect a true homemaker but these girls are going to be unprepared even for that. They are being infantalized.

Seriously!

If they are "training to be homemakers", they should be TRAINING.

How about some cooking classes? Nutrition? Gardening? Quilting? Childcare? SOMETHING?

Can they cook? Like, seriously? Could either one of them successfully make a Thanksgiving dinner? Can either go to the grocery store and buy a week's worth of groceries that a family could utilze for meals and snacks for a week?

What happens if neither get married...ever? Do they continue just floundering around forever? Can your husband support them both, forever, even after he passes away? Can you imagine being retired and his "girls" are still just hanging out in their rooms.

Big freaking yikes to you. No way in hell this would be my home life.

TBH it weird. Like, children of the corn only adult women instead of creepy kids.

Posted my comment before seeing yours.

100% agree! Although my daughters are NOW stay at home moms they didn't plan for it but when they were in their teens and in high school they took classes that would help them work and have life skills!

I think it is all avoidance

DH is avoiding the confrontation and my SDs are avoiding growing up. The girls are not traditional, they just don't want to do anything they don't want to do. It is all choices, I just feel like I do not have a voice in the conversation. If DH is avoiding setting the boundaries and holding them accountable and capable or insisting they seek help if their depression etc. is getting in the way, that is a choice too. It just isn't my choice. They do not do anything outside of their rooms and their dad is okay with it.

Unbelievable

Your DH is acting out of sheer selfishness. He wants to keep his "little ones" around him because it makes him feel good. If he had any consideration for their future lives, he would have lit a fire under them a long time ago. He is handicapping them for life. Can you imagine if either of them picked an abuser to marry? She would have absolutely no financial means of escape and, due to never learning any life skills, wouldn't know where to start.

Besides that, in this day and age, who can afford the luxury of being a "homemaker"? How many men would be willing to lead them to the altar with the full knowledge taht he will be the sole earner for the home? IT's just not going to happen. How many boyfriends have they had to date?

What is the most likely thing to happen is that they continue living like hermits in your home until the bitter end. So put a lid on that NOW. The harsh truth is that they are unlikely to ever get married. Time to define a time limit for their futures, they need a bit of pressure on them to actually DO something with their lives. How about age 25? In the meantime, they should be doing all of the housework. That's the best way to learn to be a homemaker. ALL of the chores, whether it be mopping floors, cleaning windows, weeding the garden, drawing up a budget, planning meals, buying and cooking food (on a limited budget, of course), painting walls ... it's all homemaker stuff. Sitting in their rooms is wasting their lives.

Like I said, your DH is doing this because it makes him happy - when he dies, they could be out on the street. In reality, what he's doing to them, hobbling them, is sick. Nobody ever "lost" a child who is THAT dependent on them just because they were expected to work like everyone else.

BM2 is doing the same thing

BM2 is doing the same thing to SS17 and SS15....Apparently, they are taught that housework is a womans job. The first time they cleaned a toilet was at my house and they were both 16 and 14....they were pretty upset about having to do it. They are extremely co dependent on their mother and have no life skill. One of them has social anxiety and clinical depression. They will be with her until their mid 30s probably. This is what she wants and I suspect once they turn older, she will ramp up the narcissism by complaining that they dont help her with anything and good for nothing like their dad when in reality, she created this so they can always go to her and depend on her. Idk what this is called

BM1 is even worse. She told SS21 that he didnt need to ever do any housework because he will work and his wife will do everything. This caused big problems when he moved in with us as he was very messy and destructive and expected me to clean up after him because im a "woman". BM1 parentified SD23 by making her babysit and clean after her brothers. She left the house at 16yo to move in with her bf and his parents and is now an OF model providing entirely for her bf and maintaining the house. A sad state of affairs.

Keep in mind these mothers arent the "traditional" type but expect their sons to be waited on hand and foot by traditional women

This kind of crap blows my

This kind of crap blows my mind. My mother had 5 brothers and a sister. My grandfather was in the merchant navy and absent a lot. My grandmother made sure that everyone could cook,clean,and take care of themselves. There was no such thing as "women's work" . My mother continued the work with me and my brother. Naturally, I did too (MIL was shocked to see DH washing the dishes after a meal she was invited to - I explained that we were both at work all day and that I wasn't his slave,that one of us did the cooking and the other washed the dishes - she saw my point).

I do not understand why any responsible parent would want to socially cripple his children by allowing them to stay cooped up in their rooms all the time.

PS - MIL was also taken aback when she found me chopping logs . I had a highly stressful job at the time and splitting logs was a great way of evacuating my stress so I could enjoy my weekend.

I agree - DH gets defensive, so I assume he does too

When I pointed out this feels abusive or negligent, allowing them to live like hermits, not forcing them to get jobs/take classes anything...DH got very defensive, so I know he is not fully okay with the situation. He defends that they were handicaped by the pandemic and are depressed, no longer see a point to anything. Okay - then counceling. Problem is, DH struggles with depression too and I am just confused by what say I have. I cannot set dates and deadlines, that is not for stepparents. I just don't wnat to get so fed up I pull away.

Does he think that they are

Does he think that they are the only people who were "handicapped" by the pandemic? Seriously?

Secondly, you may have no voice in setting dates for his daughters but you CAN set dates for the occupation of your home. You HAVE a voice.

I'm sorry but I would have no respect for a guy who was stunting his daughters lives, their future. Is he in therapy for his depression? By

Therapy and next steps

DH has been in therapy off and on for years. We went to couples therapy weekly for 2 years and we each saw individual therapists. I still go, he does not think it works. Which is probably why he does not make his girls go. I respect and love him very much I think he is operating from a place of fear and exhaustion. It has been a fight every step of the way with emtional manipulation from his girls and his ex. Threats of suicide or self harm, he has called it out in the past and it stopped when he stopped lecturing and pressuring them. There mother lived on her sisters couch for 4 years, so they have twisted values and goals for themselves. DH just wants them to be safe over all else, even over self sufficient. I just have completely different standards.

Take the threats of suicide

Take the threats of suicide seriously. Call emergency services and have the suicidal individual taken away and treated for their own safety. Threatening suicide without intention of following through is simply emotional blackmail. Threatening suicide with the intention of following through is serious and needs to be taken seriously. You don't get to decide which it is, not your call. Let the qualified medical personnel take over.

Yes it is for stepparents. It

Yes it is for stepparents. It's your home too. If your dh won't cooperate, figure out what you have to do (talk to a lawyer that offers free consultations) to force them out yourself.

I think you cave to consider

I think you cave to consider the impact of the pandemic on their lives and how it allowed some natural introvert tendencies to magnify. They need to get some help re entering the world.

I do agree. My bio

Son really struggled, he had just achieved certification in one part of IT that allowed him to apply for entry level positions with companies. He went to a job fair March 4th 2020, got a few interviews set up and then closures of his school and hiring freezes happened. It really was a struggle for him to get back into the groove and find himself again. He now has no interest in IT and that's ok he has found work he loves doing so eventually he got there but I tell ya it's been a rough 3 years.

DH needs to step up

But that help has to be DH, right? I have tried to inquire, dialougue and make suggestions. I have been told it is "very upsetting" to the SDs and they feel I am going to kick them out "like I did their brother." Completely not true, their brother tells everyone what he thinks they want to hear, so he told me he wanted to move out and be on his own, that sharing a bathroom with a 16 & 12 year old (my sons) was an awaking that he needs to grow up and move out. He told his dad he thought it was time to mature and would work harder at his job if he was on his own and finally, he told his sisters that he didn't want to leave them, but with my sons moving in, it would be best. The girls felt abandonded by their brother and the only person they could blame was me.

This is relatable to me because of how I grew up.

That said: I would insist they take life skills classes. They want to be stay at home moms? Great. Bookkeeping 101, organization workshops, cooking classes, gardening courses. Early childhood development classes. The list goes on and on. If these girls have not been raised in and taught these things where are they going to magically acquire them? Even some of the most "old fashioned" communities I've known in my lifetime offer/present "girls " with these opportunities. I would insist. If your DH balks at them getting out a few times a week for the enrichment I've mentioned, then you'll know you've got a whole different set of issues.

As a stepparent? Or DH?

If my biokids were in this situation, I would definitely have a different approach. I would have them doing the cooking, cleaning and shopping - or at least some of it. But DH said, "Treating them like Cinderella is not going to help them and they will resent you and me." I think a lot of the issue is how I approached my concern originally (in December). I said I expected them to be in part-time jobs, or school and counseling (or a combination of all it) by June. Now it is May and they have not applied for a single job or classes. DH is a bit depressed about all of it and everything blows up quickly when it comes up. Something has to change.

Ultimately you’re going to.

Have to have this conversation with your DH, I would suggest bringing it up during a calm time or even let him know "when you've got a moment I would like to chat with you about something weighing on me" I know these conversations are not easy, I've been the giver and receiver of them. The other option is you mentioned therapy? Would he go with you and have the conversation with an intermediary ?

A homemaker has a harder job

A homemaker has a harder job than a professional. I much prefer my days at work than my days at home! I am not a homemaker but I do most of the household labor, therefore I could say that I am a homemaker without staying at home.

Turn off the wifi and give them a list of chores including cleaning, cooking and grocery shopping with a budget. If they want to be homemakers, they need to make dinner for you and your husband at least twice a week and rooms/house need to be spotless.

I grew up in a traditional environment although my mother mostly had me focusing on school but the girls in my environment were expected to help their mothers in housework and admin 24/7 on top of their schoolwork. By the time they would go to their husbands, they were able to hold a house and care for children independently.

Again, a homemaker is like a job and you need to be prepared for it...Your husband should have them help in household duties 24/7

Cinderella

I agree, completely. The trouble is, DH thinks of this as "our house" and them as "his little girls". So he beleives we should hanlde the chores around the house, they can keep their rooms and bathroom cleaned and do their laundry. That is enough for now. He thinks they will feel like Cinderella if we make them clean our house and he would "prefer they use their time finding jobs"...but, that is not how they use their time - it is beyond frustrating to witness.

Its really deep....Your

Its really deep....Your husband is seeking for them to remain codependent. This is a dysfunctional parent-child relationship. You have no choice or say so you will have to develop coping mechanisms. At this pt, even if the SDs get married, they will be back at your house when the divorce happens. They arent responsible and he is stopping them from adulting.

This will have a lifetime of consequences on your household and there is nothing you can do about it

Also cinderella is treated like a servant/slave. That is far different from grown women doing chores and working in the house. Is that how he will feel when they go home to their husbands? That the husbands are treating them like cinderella because they do housework which they claimed they signed up for?

A homemaker is a job and helping in a house that you live in is a requirement and a duty. I felt honored when my mother would ask me to do chores or if I did something around the house for her as a young adult woman....There is a sense of pride in being able to alleviate and share domestic burdens from your parent....But again that is if you are raised "old fashioned"/traditionally which clearly your husband isnt and just pretending to be

My counselor agrees with you

The oddest part is how hard DH and I both worked to stop our codependency. We were both raised by negligent/anxious avoident parents and recognized it as adults, went to therapy to work through it and so the cycle. Now he is experiencing and allowing for the cycle to repeat itself. I think it has a lot to do with the guilt of leaving them in the care of their bipolar mother for so long. He lied to himself about how bad it was at her place and once she got evicted and was encouraging their kids to drop out of high school and taking money from the oldest son to pay bills, DH stepped in and took them. The youngest girl was 13 at the time, and the other was 16 and the brother was 18. We were just married, so it added a lot of stress.

My counselor agrees with you, I will need coping strategies more than anything, bc if he cannot see this is destructive or will not change course there is nothing I can do.

What does it look like 10 or

What does it look like 10 or 20 years from now? They'll still be living with you because they have no life skills or job skills? Is that ok with you?

He has a seriously messed up codependent relationship with those girls. For some reason he needs them to remain dependent on him. Does anyone else in his family see it, and will they talk with him? Will he talk through this with a counselor? I think that's truly your only hope. Nothing will change if nothing changes.

Outlook bleak

No itvwill not be okay with me! That is the scariest part. I want to grow old with my DH, we are in our mid forties now and several of my friends are empty nesters... I'm so scared I will never be. DH has a brother, 38, who still lives with their mother. The do not speak bc DH thinks his brother is living off their mom and not a grown up. Then he allows the same thing from his daughters. He truly beleives they are depressed and have social anxiety issues preventing their capabilities, but they have finished high school without meddling and they each had a job before the pandemic for a year. They are capable, now they are just manipulating the situation and he allows it.

I agree that the pandemic

I agree that the pandemic caused a lot of problems with kids. It made my daughter start procrastinating, since the online work can be turned in from home at any time as opposed to the teacher picking it up at a certain time. She may fail 2 classes. Her depression worsened, too. I'm having a hard time getting her to do her schoolwork and get a job. She is in therapy. One thing i have told her and her therapist is that i will NOT have her give up on life and be a basement dweller for the rest of her life. If school isn't for her, she will have to find a trade or another way. Since she's a boyish lesbian, having a man take care of her isn't in the cards. Giving up is not an option.

I've considered the military

I've considered the military for her, but there's another problem, too. She gained about 80 lbs during the pandemic. I'm in healthcare and was working more than ever. She was home alone doing "online school", and i couldn't supervise her eating or activities. I get that the pandemic was harmful, but you CAN'T GIVE UP! I got her a gym membership and buy healthy foods. It's a constant battle against the bad habits she developed for the 1.5 or so years she was poorly supervised.

You may have to accept DH's shit parenting, but you do not have

to respect it.

Your DH is a failed father. PERIOD DOT! A parent's job is to prepare their children for love, it is not to protect them from life. Your DH has done shit for nothing to prepare his daughters to be adults. I get that the pandemic was impactful on many peoplel if not all people. However, it is now nothing more than an excuse.

Two adult SD's do not have anything but "their own time". It is time to inform DH the date that the locks will be re-keyed and the SD's will launch. That they have tied anchors around their own ankles is on them. Not on you. If he so much as tries to argue. Make it clear that they are out on that date. The only question is, will he be your equity life partner and husband, or will be out when his failed family adult progeny are out.

There comes a time when children who have not figured it out, to finish growing up on their own dime and their own time. That time is long past due for these wannabe kept women SAHMs.

Don't get me wrong, I have every respect for women, or men, who are SAHPs. However, SAHPs have to be equity life partners with their mates. That is not a financial equation. My own mom was a SAHM. She and my dad are absolutely equity life partners, have built their lives and a family together for nearly 61 years of marriage. What my mother has never been is entitled. She and my dad are partners. Your SD's are looking for some dipshit to support them.

My mother has never aspired to being a kept woman. She has made an incredible life, home, and family as a SAHM with her best friend. My dad has done the same. She is the heartbeat of the family, and dad's champion. Dad is the breadwinner and mom's champion.

From evcen the bit of information provided on your unwanted room mates, your SD's will ruin some poor man's life. Probably the lives of several men.

Do not let them or their failed father ruin your life or the lives of your minor children.

IMHO of course.

Good luck. You are going to need it.

Take care of you.

As for your DH being the beck and call boy for his miniwives/emoptional incest partners, nope. He is not their DH, he is yours.

Our son (my former SS-30 who I adopted) had a bit of struggle launching. So, he was our live in beck and call boy/chore bitch after HS graduation and turning 18. We lit the burning platform and he either launched or had his tail feathers continually scorched as we fed the flames buring the platform.

We worked that kid's butt off. He did a minimum of 8hrs a day of chores while his mom and I were at work. Then he prepared, cooked, served, and cleaned up after dinner. If he got it all done by bedtime, he got to do it all again the next day. If not, he was out the next day until we returned from work. Then.. he had to get the unfinished chores from the previous day done, plus that day's chores done. If not... on the curb as we drove off for work the next AM.

Our home was fully wired so we turned off othe internet and cable TV when we left.

After 5mos he enlised in the USAF on the delayed entry program. We continued to fan the flames of the burning platform until he reported to MEPS to leave for BMT. He was our life in worker for 8mos. He learned that housing, food, clothing, etc... take work.

He has never asked us for a cent since he launched. He is doing great.

You have been allowing these two women to invade your home and marriage for 3yrs and 5yrs respectively. Grow a pair, and give DH clarity.

They go, and they go now.

Daddy's poor pandemic impacted entitmement mini wives need to go and go now. You can bet that DH would not tolerate two mini husbands (20 and 23) to be in his home displacing him with his wife.

You may have to accept DH's shit parenting, but you do not have

to respect it.

Your DH is a failed father. PERIOD DOT! A parent's job is to prepare their children for life, it is not to protect them from life. Your DH has done shit for nothing to prepare his daughters to be adults. I get that the pandemic was impactful on many people if not all people. However, it is now nothing more than an excuse.

There comes a time when children who have not figured it out, to finish growing up on their own dime and their own time. That time is long past due for these wannabe kept women SAHMs.

From the bit of information provided on your unwanted room mates, your SD's will ruin some poor men's lives. Probably the lives of several men.

Do not let them or their failed father ruin your life or the lives of your minor children.

IMHO of course.

Good luck. You are going to need it.

Take care of you.

As for your DH being the beck and call boy for his miniwives/emotional incest partners, nope. He is not their DH, he is yours.

Our home was fully wired so we turned off othe internet and cable TV when we left.

After 5mos he enlisted in the USAF on the delayed entry program. We continued to fan the flames of the burning platform until he reported to MEPS to leave for BMT. He was our life in worker for 8mos. He learned that housing, food, clothing, etc... take work.

He has never asked us for a cent since he launched. He is doing great.

You have been allowing these two women to invade your home and marriage for 3yrs and 5yrs respectively. Grow a pair, and give DH clarity.

Daddy's poor pandemic impacted entitmement mini wives need to go and go now. You can bet that DH would not tolerate two mini husbands (20 and 23) to be in his home displacing him with his wife.

Enablement

Enablement to the point of disablement is not parenting.

Asking them to please contribute to the household that supports them is not treating them like slaves.

Your DH is messed up in his thinking.

Who owns he house? You BOTH do. You are disengaged until it affects you. 2 grown up women living off of you in your household affects you. Period. Have the conversations. Do not waver.

Being old-fashioned is one thing

But your DH sounds like he is crippling the girls through control. He's not doing them any favors by allowing them to hide away from society. How will they figure life out? They can wait around for prince charming to show up but they'll more than likely have another controlling man for a husband. I'm sorry, it sounds like an incredibly unhealthy setup.

Your SD's

Your' SD's should join a church that supports stay at home women. Ahem. Maybe the Mormons? If that's what they want, then they will find husbands there or maybe with some uber-christian cult. The bonus of them joining a cult is that you won't be allowed to see them!

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SD 20 & 23 failure to launch...or even start engines