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Issues with Ex-Wife....are these things normal and acceptable?

LonelyStepFiancee's picture

I cant believe I never found this forum before!  I had been a member of another forum for many years while I was raising my daugther, but now that mine is grown and I'm looking at marrying my fiancee I need some support as I'm getting really concerned.

So, aside from the fact that he and I share completely different parenting styles, which appears is pretty normal for step families, I learned to stay out of his relationship and parenting styles with his kids.  I very rarely even say anything anymore.   However, I've always been a bit leery of his relationship with his ex-wife, which I guess is what concerns me the most with moving forward.  But, I dont know if its just me being unreasonable or if these are really unacceptable activities. 

I guess I'm lucky in the fact that he doesnt (as far as I'm aware -- we only live together part time right now due to work locations) have any physical type of relations with his ex, but even things like being very much aware of what is going on in her life, who she is dating, all about the guy, where they are going, etc. he also does things for her personally.   Aside from regularly discussing her personal life she is usually calling or texting asking to borrow things to use around her house and the most recent was she asked him to buy her something on Amazon as he has a prime account and she needed it the next day.   She could have easily signed up for a free trial of Prime if she wanted, but I really feel that she asked him because she is attempting to try and wiggle her way back into his life and she knows he wont say anything.

Now, I will freely admit that I found this out through his text messages because he's been very secretive and hiding things from me lately so I peeked to see what was going on.  No harsh words about this please, I dont make it a regular habit, but when things start getting suspcious then I'm going to check and find out whats going on for myself.   However, I cant really tell him that I know this either without letting on that I read the message.  When I bring up the fact that they have been texting a lot back and forth lately, he doesnt show me his phone like I would in reverse, he scrolls through their messages and picks and chooses things that are more innocent to make mention of and show me only that particuar text.   This just screams 'not innocent' to me.  

So, his overall reaction is to just state that he wants to keep an amicable relationship with her and accuses me of wanting them to have a contenious relationship which isnt true.  I feel that exes should be cordial and nice to each other when interacting ,but that should be maintained in a professional, business like manner, not like they are best friends still!  

So, (sorry this is so long), am I overacting or is this really normal?  How would you handle it?  Leave it be?  Bring it up, even though he would then know that I read his text?  

Thanks for any advice!

SteppedOut's picture

Honestly, it doesn't matter what anyone else thinks is "acceptable" - because in the end it only matters how YOU feel about this. If you need stronger boundaries to feel secure and comfortable in a relationship, then that is what you need! This difference in opinion, along with the "completely different parenting styles" are going to cause major problems in your relationship. Until you can find some middle ground (if even possible), I would hold off on the wedding!

For the record, I would not be ok with this behavior. 

 

tog redux's picture

No, it's not normal. Amicable doesn't mean discussing your personal life and using your ex's Amazon Prime account, it means being civil and pleasant to each other.

Both the issues with the ex AND the parenting style difference will become much bigger problems when you live together full-time.

Please don't marry this guy.

LonelyStepFiancee's picture

Does anyone have any suggestions on how to bring this up?  If I mention about the Amazon thing, he's going to know and that in itself may be a deal breaker.  I dont want to break up, but I do want him to scale back his relationship with his ex.

I've already brought up the generic boundaries and my dissatisfaction with how much they talk....even as often about the kids since they are old enough to contact their father directly without mommy dearest interfering, but it never ges anywhere.  I feel like I really need to go into more specifics but not sure how best to go about it while maintaining a normal adult conversation instead of an angry response.

tog redux's picture

The thing is - you can't control what he does and doesn't do. You can only let him know that the extent of his relationship with his ex-wife is bothersome to you.  He can then choose whether to make changes or not - and the fact that he's already acting as if you are the one in the wrong is not a good sign.

Honestly, if I ever felt the need to snoop on DH's phone, I'd know we were in trouble.

holyschnikes's picture

I would be upfront with him and tell him you've noticed he's been acting shady with his phone so you looked. Most people would do the same if they noticed their partner acting differently with their phone. I don't encourage snooping , but hey, that's sometimes the only way you find things out. Better than having a rug pulled over your eyes. 

Disneyfan's picture

If you have an issue with the way they interact, speak up.  He will either hear you and change, or not.  At that point you have to decidevif you can continue in the relationship or not.

 

DHsfamilyfromhell's picture

Notyourmomma is right, he’s enmeshed with her. 

They are only divorced on paper but emotionally a lot of the ties are there. He has serious boundary issues and if he knows about her relationships, then it’s likely she knows the details of his. 

I would not want to be with someone like that. 

Kes's picture

1 they are enmeshed with each other to an unhealthy degree for the welfare of any future relationship of either of them

2 don't marry this guy, at least not yet, and don't give up your home 

3 come clean about reading his texts, say it was because you were so suspicious of his relationship with his ex, apologise, and say this is the major stumbling block to your relationship with him.  See what he says.  Don't ever read his texts again.  It is flagrant abuse of privacy.  

markwvualum's picture

Exes should have a cordial, amicable relationship for the sake of the kids. However this should be more like a friendly business like relationship rather than a emeshed friendship. They should not be discussing one anothers personal lives, sharing amazon, netflix accounts, hanging out in one another's homes, etc. That ship has sailed and in order for the kids not to feel confused and for the intimacy of new relationship to be protected there needs to be this thing called boundaries. No coming into the home, no discussing personal lives or things other than the kids, no calling/texting one another unless it involves the kids and scheduling. I find if the kids are old enough it is best to have them call the ex instead of the ex always calling you, if it is just to speak to them. I do not blame you for snooping thru the phone. It is not as if you are doing it regularly to keep track  of someone and control them. You suspected something and you looked. You found something. Not a big deal however the fact that you had to look at their phone suggests something is off to begin with. (it is). They are emeshed and lack boundaries. It sounds like the ex has not moved on. Until they get some boundaries there will be no room for you, or any other healthy relationship. The moment he got into a relationship with you was when he should have stopped having conversations with the ex about things not involving their kids, stopped allowing ex to hang out in the house, stopped sharing amazon, netflix accounts, etc. however I can tell you unless he wants to change and sees a problem with this nothing will change. It is the same with people who cannot parent their kids and their kids act entitled and poorly behaved. If they do not see the problem with it nothing is likely to change. People like this will go thru relationship after relationship wondering what went wrong never acknowledging the problem. In this case the fact that their emeshment with their ex is the problem that has prevented a new relationship from flourishing, time and time again. He needs to get some boundaries but it needs to come from him wanting that.

caitlinj's picture

Do not marry this guy. Do not sell your home. His emeshment with his ex will jeopordize the intimacy any future relationship he has and will cause nothing but turmoil. He needs to be the one to change and set those boundaries. If he does not want to do it, move on. It is not a healthy situation to be in unless you are content with being a third wheel.

Harry's picture

This bothers you, It would bother me.  It doesn’t matter, if it dose not bother someone else, they are not living your life.  You are living your life.  If it bothers you now, it will always bother you.  

You have to have that talk with your BF,  telling him this has to stop. Only discussion is by text or e mail, and it’s limited to kids.  Pick up time, there events, ect.  Nothing personal, nothing about the EX love life. 

You have to find out NOW how he is going to react,  Hopefully he does not realize what he doing and will stop. Or else you must make plans to leave before you invest more into this relationship.  Unless you want the EX running your life 

Thumper's picture

Please give us an idea of what YOU think you should say---OK?

You know your boyfriend better than we do.

 

LonelyStepFiancee's picture

So it came up already today due to other circumstances and unfortunately it didnt go well *sad*

I just stated that I was bothered by their conversations that were personal in nature and felt that it was disrespectful to me, our relationship and not appropriate.  Particularly the Amazon shopping, borrowing stuff, etc.     Just like normal he immediately got defensive and went into periods of 1) he said he didnt want to do those things, but to keep the peace, didnt want to tell her no, 2) that he doesnt think we are compatible because I always complain (the only thing I complain about is the kids and his ex! He even stated that we get along great otherwise!) and it sounds like he wasnt willing to do anything differently.  He of course disagreed iwth the fact that he was enmeshed with her, in a "wife just not on paper" relationship, etc. and just defended himself, her and his actions over and over again.   Im not sure how to get through to him now, he thinks that I should never be bothered by anything and that he is looking for someone 'easy-going', which to me means a bimbo that doenst care what he does, when he does it, who he does it with, etc just as long as they are getting what they want.  Sorry but Im near 50 years old and certainly going to stand up for myself.  Funny that I mention to him that I get opinions from others oline and he complains about that and thinks its ridciulous, but yet his son is on his computer 24/7 when not in school and has no friends in the real world so I told him to not even go there as if he thinks its ok for a 16 year old to only converse with people online, who could even be child molesters for all he knows, then he cant say anything to me about speaking to othe adults online for opinions!  

He swears up and down that he doesnt want anything to do with her physically, sexually, emotionally, etc. but that he should just "delete his text messages" (his response).

So, I have no idea where it stands now, but Im sticking to my guns on this one.  He went out for a bit but says he will be back later.  I'll updare.

MissTexas's picture

Now it's out in the open. Notice how angry and defensive he has gotten? He knows you're hitting a nerve. Why would he defend himself and his ex? He hasn't made the "single man" transition, How long have they been divorced? Doesn't seem too long.

The "we're not compatible" thing would be repeated when he needed or wanted your sex. "Oh honey, I'm sorry. You and I are not compatible. It's just you and your hand, or ex tonight."

As for him deleting texts, WHY? If he has NOTHING TO HIDE, then leave them alone. I would (& do) gladly leave my texts on my phone if I had nothing to hide.

The son sounds like he has no life but the computer. This is odd. That will be another issue. Dad will be expected to take up the friend slack and entertain him.

Girl, please, you are approaching 50. Life is short. There' s no time for this anxiety and angst.

Please,  move on.

Harry's picture

Like fifth in his life.  1 is him, 2 is EX , 3 the kids, 4 the cat, 5 you.  Unless there’s more pets.   He not going to ever see it your way.  He never going to see anything your way if it interferes with him, the Ex, The Kidd.   All he wants is your money, so he can treat the EX the way she wants. 

 

Sandybeaches's picture

This is not normal behavior or boundaries for an ex.  The face that he got defensive shows that he knows he is wrong he is just trying to deflect it back on you.  

While you can't change other people you can force him to see your point of view by standing your ground on this situation.  Ad much as you like or love him, he is not willing to put you first and that is where you should be if you are thinking of marriage.  

I would not put up with this and just the fact that you asked us really answers the question for you as to whether it is right or wrong.  It is wrong for you as you wouldn't be asking if it weren't and it doesn't matter what we think.  

NoWireCoatHangarsEVER's picture

It wouldn't be to me.  I was you, btw.  She would take selfies of herself and send them to him and he would save them to his phone.  I found a video diary of her in her bedroom that she shared with her man doing her hair that she sent to him and saved 

on the laptop I got him for Christmas.  She would still refer to herself as his wife when their kids were on my health insurance and we would be on a three way call with the insurance company. 

He cried like a baby when she got engaged.

And then we got engaged and the day before we were supposed to get married, he cried again.  SOBBED.  And said he couldn't marry me. 

Why are you letting him call all the shots?  Take back your power.  If it were me (and it was me so I know where I went wrong) I would break it off.      

bananaseedo's picture

Oh dear heavens, so sorry!!  Out of curiosity-did he go back to his ex when you guys broke up?  That is seriously someone who wasn't over his ex.  

hereiam's picture

He sees nothing wrong with how he and his ex interact, he's definsive about it, even. There's your answer, he likes things the way it is. The not telling her no to keep the peace, is not a valid excuse. Why does he not want to "keep the peace" with you? Keep YOU happy?

He really does just need someone who is okay with all of this because you will not change him, he doesn't want to change. This is exactly how he wants it to be, this is who he is.

Find somebody who will make YOU their priority. Someone who wants to make YOU happy. This guy ain't him.

Sandybeaches's picture

There is nothing wrong with you looking at his text!!!  There should be absolutley NOTHING between an SO and an ex that is not an open book for you to see!!!  

tog redux's picture

Not everyone feels the same way about that. I would happily show DH my text messages if he asked, but I don't want him snooping and he doesn't want me snooping either.

Sandybeaches's picture

Understood but there should be nothing that your partner can't see in your text messages.  And most certainly nothing from an ex or someone of the opposite sex.  If your partner feels worried enough to need to check text messages then there is something wrong for sure.  Just saying....

Thumper's picture

Sandybeaches YOU are correct. There should not be anything between him and his ex that is private..

Harry--Oh harry you nailed it with "All he wants is your money, so he can treat the EX the way she wants".

 

OP When boyfriend said your not compatible...believe him. Its a win for you actually. You deserve better and he should just go back to his ex sooner than later. I believe he will.

I am sorry.

ndc's picture

I am all for ex-spouses having a cordial relationship.  My DH had an amicable divorce from BM.  They are cooperative in raising the kids, meaning that they accommodate requested schedule changes if possible, they discuss and coordinate activities, they can go to a kid's event or a parent teacher conference together and be friendly.  The cordial relationship does not extend to being friends, discussing their personal lives, buying each other things, doing personal favors, etc. 

It wasn't always this way.  When I came into the picture the divorce was brand new and they still did things together with the kids, they celebrated holidays together, they texted and called each other about things other than the kids (mostly the kids, but not exclusively).  I do not think for a minute that they were sleeping together or anything like that, but they were too enmeshed for my liking.  I told DH that he was welcome to continue that relationship with BM, but then his relationship with me would be over.  I insisted on boundaries.  I was perfectly happy for them to be cordial and cooperative and I understand and accept that they will have a relationship until the kids are adults.  But they didn't need to have a relationship other than to raise their kids cooperatively.  It was my hill to die on.  I would have left if DH hadn't put up the boundaries, and he knew it.  If it was more important for him to keep the peace with BM than to make me happy, I would have been gone.  It wasn't a threat, it was just the way it was.  And since it was early on in our relationship, it wasn't difficult to bring it up and let him know how things needed to be, because I didn't have a lot invested in the relationship.  

You need to decide how much of a dealbreaker this is for you, and whether it's your hill to die on.  If it is, then I think you need to be direct.

LonelyStepFiancee's picture

Well it's over. He at first had agreed to cut back his relationship with her but then as we were leaving to go to dinner I found out that he had changed the passcode to his phone. I got upset about that, he left for good and said he didn't want to be with me anymore. 

I explained that if he didn't have anything to hide that he wouldn't need to hide and that we should be able to read each other's messages whenever or for whatever reason I felt the need to. He stated that he just didn't want to deal with me getting upset over anything and that we were on different pages with that so he left for a better future. I'm still of the opinion that everything should be open so if he isn't willing to be open with me when we were supposed to be getting married then I guess we didn't have a relationship much less a marriage. 
Although I am highly emotional and upset his actions made me see that he isn't willing to be honest and do whatever it takes to make a relationship work. Hopefully I can get passed this. Although I'm extremely mad I'm still very hurt and upset that my future husband is now gone out of my life. 
Thank you everyone for your replies. I will go back and read them again when I start to feel weak and sad. 

hereiam's picture

I'm sorry that you are going through this but there is a reason he is hiding things. Living with someone like that, never being able to completely trust them, is no way to live.

MissTexas's picture

feeling sad and angry, I'm very happy he made the choice to move on. You dodged a double bullet. The ex and the kid would always have been the fly in your ointment.

Please know that given the information provided in your posts, this is the right thing for you. Some people just come to our lives for a season. They're not meant to be there forever. I think an extraordinary man is in your future!

Halijax's picture

I'm so, so sorry to read this, LonelyStepFiancee. You are a strong woman and you did the right thing. I admire your strength. You will be ok, and your instincts were right.

Lollybobs's picture

Whether or not it's ok to read someone's messsages isn't the issue. He wasn't being honest with you and there comes a point when you do what's needed in order to get to the truth and protect yourself. It sounds like it' s a good job you're out of that relationship now.

stepgirlfriendfurmom's picture

ended between the two of you, but it sounds like it is definitely for the best. In regards to your comment about looking at his phone, that is something that is different for everyone's relationship. My boyfriend and I have a total open phone policy, it has been that way for a while now. We follow a total transparency style relationship, but this does not work for everyone.

If he got this defensive and used the excuse of "for the kids" then it is all him trying to gaslight you because he knows what he is doing is wrong. You deserve way better! Find a man who prioritizes you, not acts as though he is still married to his ex.

MissTexas's picture

relationship.

I know it is easier said than done when the heart is involved, however, you are not married YET.

You've already indicated your parenting style and his do not align. Friend, believe me, this will become a bigger problem as time goes on. There are endless posts here about similar situations, and the kids never launch, then dad is giving them money constantly, allowing them to live in the marital home, and on and on and on.

As for checking texts, I am not that type of person either. However, that being said, when you're a very intuitive person as I am, and you seem to be, then I will have to play detective to get THE TRUTH, as we know these men will not tell us the truth.

I've made it clear to DH that anything communicated electronically can be retrieved, so PLEASE STOP emailing SD, texting and calling her to talk about me. I WILL FIND IT, even if a court order is necessary. Momma used to say, "If you don't want the world to know never put it out there." 

The fact that he's selecting which texts to his ex that he will show you is very telling. Not to be a pessimist, but I'm willing to bet they are still sleeping together, and if this is not the case, they are still definitely very emotionally ENMESHED, which is even WORSE.

Please think this through. It's not looking or sounding good.

ndc's picture

I'm sorry your ex-fiance did not choose you and the future instead of BM and the past.  Maybe BM wasn't quite in the past, or maybe he wasn't ready for a new relationship.  In any event, I suspect you dodged a bullet.  I hope you find a partner who will put you first and be upfront and honest.

LonelyStepFiancee's picture

Thank you everyone for the additional messages and posts since last time I updated on Saturday.   I'm so sad at times and severely missing my fiancee.   I know that I'm in the right and thankfully I have 30+ people backing me up to know that my thoughts on this are justified.  I have been known to be irrational with some things in the past and question whether my opinions were realistic or not, but reading everyone's comments at least I know Im right on this one.  

However unfortunately that doesnt take away the sting and the heartbreak.  Other than when we fought about the kids, which had become less and less over the years when I realized that I wasnt getting through to him anyway, we got along great!  We hav a lot of fun together, enjoy many of the same things, we were even shopping for camping trailers with plans to start camping with our friends and even taking longer trips away now that his kids are older.  Im really struggling with losing all of that. Sad  

Aside from just missing him, our daily chats, time spent together, when he would come over to me on the couch just to kiss me, etc. Im just having a really hard time understanding where he is coming from!  It just doesnt make sense to me!  We've been together for years...he has been divorced for years, why is he still letting his ex wife interfere?  Why are her feelings more important than mine...someone he is supposed to love and want to be with?  It just doesnt make sense!!!  I can certainly understanding wanting to keep a cordial relationship with her, but its like he sees things in only black and white, whereas they are either close friends or enemies.  Why cant it be something in between??  I'm sorry Im rambling, but Im an analytical type of person that has a need to understand things for them to make sense to me, no matter what it is.  This I just cant understand!

I guess time heals all wounds, but its really hard and I currently dont have any close friends nearby to lean on.  Some of my friends dont want to tak about it as they are also friends with him and I guess they are tired of hearing about our issues over the years and then a few other friends I have nearby are off on a multi week vacation, so here I sit at home feeling lonely, wondering what he is doing with nothing to do myself.  :(   The bitter icing on the cake is that Im in between jobs myself so I dont have a lot of disposable income right now to be able to go out and do anything on my own.  Cant go shopping, cant go out to eat, cant buy anything for a hobby to keep myself busy, etc...ugghhhh!

StepUltimate's picture

I am proud of you, glad to see your update.

I am sorry for all you're feeling right now (naturally grieving the loss of the relationship) but also hopeful that soon, you'll be looking back at this moment & feeling calm, satisfied, excited about your life, and grateful you did not stay in the impossible, "Man + his Ex + his GF/Fiancee" scenario.

I also relate to your self-doubt and think it was smart of you to get feedback - which pretty much validated your gut feeling was correct. I think you are brave for facing reality rather than smoking the Hopium waiting for that guy to change.

Also understand being between jobs, and encourage you to have fun on the cheap! Start going on morning walks with a friend or neighbor that has a dog/dogs. Ride your bike. Teach yourself a new skill or craft by watching free How-To YouTube videos online. Make friends & family fun, personalized b-day cards instead of buying'em. Go to the free Art Walk in your area. Type out all your feelings on StepTalk, drink plenty of water, get lots of good sleep, and take really good care of you! You're gonna get through this!

Biggrin

Rags's picture

No, these things are not normal. And ... no, they are not acceptable.