New here, with 5 teens, I'm gonna need HELP!
Hi, I'm Amy. I've got two boys who are 15 and 12 (so one is not quite a teen but he tries to act like the older siblings), two stepsons (15 and 19) and a stepdaughter (17). I met my husband in 2009, we got married in 2011. Step parenting is the hardest thing I've ever tried to do... but parenting my teen son is starting to compete. He's my biggest challenge right now.
He's the epitome of a 15 year old male - his goal in life is the exert as little effort as possible into anything. He comes home from school around 2:45 and goes into his "cave", he emerges for dinner, then goes back to the cave until it's time to go to sleep. He does not like helping out around the house or interacting with anyone, particularly me or my husband. He spends half his time with his dad, who lives about 5 miles away. Life at dad's house is easy - just the two boys (no step kids there), no chores, no rules, and dad and stepmom are very affluent and spend weekends relaxing at the country club.
I'm sure you knew this was coming... now he'd rather live full time with dad. He's a rude jerk to me - he makes snide remarks, he ignores me but when he's not, he glares at me with hatred. He complains anytime he's asked to do anything. And he often just goes to his dad's house for the afternoon, even when the custody schedule says he's with me.
Last week I overheard him on the phone telling his dad he needed to be picked up immediately, that he was afraid of me, that I was going to "hurt" him. After a few minutes of overhearing his lies, I opened his bedroom door and told him calmly that he was not in any danger but I'd be happy to give him a ride there if he felt unsafe. I told him lying about me was not acceptable and he was manipulating his dad. He said it was an "opinion and you never know when anyone is going to flip out so it was a valid comment".
I'm at a loss as to how to deal with him. He's unbearable to be around, but worst of all, his dad does not support me or back me up. I think he's thrilled that he's now the favorite parent.
Do I give him space and eventually he'll come back?
Do I stand my ground and enforce the custody schedule and our house rules?
My son and I went to see a counselor together who suggested we spend time doing some things my son enjoys. My son acted nice in front of the counselor but as soon as we left told me what a waste of time it was and there's nothing that he wants to do with me.
I know this is just a stage - eventually, he'll come around. I'm not a bad mom at all, I've done my best for my kids. There's no abuse or dysfunction in our house (apart from regular family stuff - we are not perfect), he's really got a great home and childhood - he's just a spoiled brat.
Any words of wisdom from someone who has been in a similar situation would help - or even just some general support - I've been crying myself to sleep at night and it's definitely impacting my ability to be productive at work. I feel like the choices I make with this child are impacting my younger one already - who is already threatening that he'll "just leave" whenever he gets upset at my house.
House rules/custody
Hugs, I can see you are hurting.
This is a lot of people in a house, and I can understand how some one might feel it is too much. As to your rules, yes, he should be civil and do his chores. But I think he should be able to stay in his room when he wants. I would be very careful about listening to his conversations with his dad. IMHO, it is wrong to interfere with a child's conversations with the other parents. As to custody, where I live, he is at the age where most likely he will be allowed input in where he wants to live. YOu cannot make him like you, you need to accept that.
She didn't interfere with the
She didn't interfere with the phone call, she confronted her kid about lying. She was being a good parent.
Disagree
There is no need to be a parent when child is with or talking to other parent. Let kid say whatever he wants to other parent. There is no sign that OP beleived it, he didn't come running over. Child should be allowed to say whatever he wants to other parent. OPs actions will only drive kid away qucker, in any event.
LOL OK.
LOL OK.
Sorry you are dealing with
Sorry you are dealing with this. We experienced the same with my husband's kids when they were 13 and 15.
As the SM, I was relieved that my DH let go of the rope and didn't chase after his kids when they started refusing to come over. However, leaving them to the full time care of their bff mother did them zero favors. The laziness and entitlement just increased tenfold.
The relationships between my DH and his kids are no longer volatile, but they are distant and fake. They are now 16 and 18 and I don't see a healthy outcome for many years, if ever. So, not only did "giving them space" not save the relationships, it has also severely damaged these kid's futures as nothing is expected of them.
If it were my son, I would keep dragging his ass to therapy. I would keep forcing him to do his chores and homework. I would keep giving him consequences for his shitty choices. I would keep parenting as best I knew.
He takes off without permission? (It doesn't matter where he goes.) He's grounded for two weeks. He lies over the phone about me? He loses the phone for a month. Does your son receive any consequences for his rude and hateful behavior?
Parenting is tough in ideal circumstances, but it is entirely exhausting when one parent undermines you at every turn. (((Hugs)))
I will say that it is OK if you let him live with his dad. You aren't being a bad mom if you do. If he is causing nothing but misery for the entire family, you are completely justified in wanting the misery to end. And you do have a younger child to consider. You can't sacrifice his childhood dealing with his brother all the time. However, it doesn't sound like your son is acting extreme (drugs/alcohol? fights at school? Mental health issues? Violent outbursts?) So, I can't say I would advise you to give up just yet.
It's an incredibly tough situation.
He is 15
The kid is 15. If he is allowed to go to friends, he should be allowed to go to dad's. The other parent should not be treated worse than a friend.
Suggesting draconian punishment is likely to result in kid telling dad he wants custody changed.
I would like to know more about chores. There are 7 people in this household, are chores divided fairly?
As to therapy, i think it can only help if the person wants help. This is a difficult situation.
The key phrase was "without
The key phrase was "without permission." If my child went anywhere without my permission, he would receive consequences.
Grounding a teen is Draconian? Are you 14? A mental patient?
Permission?
I would still like to know, is kid allowed to go to friends, but not dads? That is wrong.
IMHO, kid should never be punished for saying whatever he wants to other parent.
I assume, like most halfway
I assume, like most halfway decent parents, this mother doesn't let her kid go wherever he pleases without her permission.
So a kid should be able to lie to a parent without consequences? What if he was saying "eff you Dad, you effing effer!" A decent parent would issue consequences to their child for being disrespectful.
I still want to know how old you are and whether you even know the first thing about parenting.
Parent he is talking to deals with it.
1. If she allows him to visit friends, but not dad, this is worng.
2. No, the parent he is talking to should deal with it. For all OP knows, dad was saying, I really do not not think you wer in danger. And note, Dad did not come running over.
3. I have one child, and two stepchildren. All teens.
Do you think that your son
Do you think that your son will be damaged if he lives with his father? Will he be allowed to fail in school.. do drugs..or otherwise ruin his own life? Or, is your EX an OK parent.. if maybe a little more permissive...and despite your differences is a decent father to the boys.
If you think your son will be safe at his dad's.. and he is already spending a lot of time there.. I might allow him to move there full time. It sounds like your home is pretty crowded and chaotic with all the kids. and... yeah.. I'm sure the fact that dad has more money makes things a little nicer there too... Perhaps a condition is that he still attend regular counseling sessions and maintain a regular visitation schedule with you.
I'm sure your EX is appearing to love that he feels he has "won" this kid but maybe if they both get what they think they want... they may realize it isn't want they thought it was. Dad and new wife will probably start getting similar treatment that you did. In fact, they might start expecting more from a full time kid? So... I say..let them have at it. He doesn't stop being your son... your home and the other residents deserve to have a peaceful life and if your son is disruptive of all that.. its a win for everyone if he moves in with dad.
15 y/o boys are jacka$$es, I
15 y/o boys are jacka$$es, I know I was. Let him go live with Dad if that is what he wants so badly that he will lie about being scared of Mommy, but I agree also that the counseling should continue.
If you aren't afraid that
If you aren't afraid that your ex's end game is to completely cut you out, and you believe that his father will hold him accountable for decent grades, etc, then let him go live with Dad. But let him know it's a one and done, he's not coming back to live with you (so he doesn't think he can just jump back and forth).
Your house does sound very busy and I can't blame him for liking the quiet time at Dad's. But he should not be rude to you.
We've got an agreed custody
We've got an agreed custody schedule - so if he just takes off to dad's, he's not following our custody agreement. And he's doing it to get out of our house rules. The house rules are - put your phone on the family charging station at 10 pm (we found kids up at all hours on social media before we began enforcing this rule). Only one hour of video games on schools nights (after homework is finished). The chores are helping with things that my husband and I ask them to do - such as unloading or loading the dishwasher, taking out the trash, occasionally walking the dog, cleaning up after themselves. These are not extraordinary asks of them.
He has his own room, we have plenty of space in the house. Stepkids are only with us every other weekend so most often it's just 3 of us in the house (me and my two boys - my husband travels frequently for work). One kid is away at college - so although we are a family of seven when everyone is home - it's typically 3, 4, or at the most, 6 in the house. (each kid has their own room, a teen hangout space, a study room, another rec room with ping pong, a swimming pool in our backyard, adjacent to a large neighborhood park with tennis courts, etc... he's not being tortured at my house - but he is occasionally asked to come out of his room, have a conversation with his family and help out for 5-10 minutes).
I used to be very close with my 15 year old. Just a couple years ago we did a vacation together to Barcelona for 2 weeks (just the two of us). He changed the moment he started high school and became sullen, irritable, withdrawn and rude. We thought for sure he was on drugs - but I don't think so after all - I think he just was hit with puberty like a mac truck. Starting high school last year was a huge adjustment in his schedule (up 2 hours earlier each morning - from a small K-8 school of 650 kids to a high school with 3,000). He has very hard classes (3 AP classes as a sophomore) and he's exhausted much of the time. But I still don't think it's ok for him to be rude to me or anyone else in the house.
His dad was a total slacker in high school/college and doesn't lift a finger to help out at home either. That's not who I want them to be - but since that's their dad... well, I am just doing the best I can to be a good role model to them.
I don't want him to look back and think I gave up on him if I stop going to counseling (what a waste of money if he's going to act the way he does), stop trying to spend time with him (he will barely sit in the same room with me before storming off), stop going to his soccer games (he ignores me) or telling him I want him to live with me (and let him just go live with dad). But it is so incredibly hard when he's so awful to me. I read in some parenting book that the closer your kids are to you before they enter their teen years - the harder they pull away... maybe that's some consolation - and maybe he'll be back as he matures. I had the expectation that my boys as teenagers would be loving and protective of me. Lol. It's hard to see dreams like that die with a totally different reality.
My step kids pulled away from their dad as teens too - they got busy with activities at school and their friends. I think that's totally normal and try to help my husband cope with how hard that is when they'd rather be with their friends. What I'm finding hard about my son is that he's not going out and doing fun things as an alternative to interacting with his family, he's sulking in his room. It's quite possible he's depressed but he vehemently objects to that suggestion.
Custody/ Chores/etc
1. Would he be allowed to go to friends? If yes, he should be allowed to go to dads.
2. 3 AP Classes? OF COURSE he is spending a lot of time in his room.
3. Are chores divided up fairly, do stepkids help (in relation to how many days they are there? or is just your kids?
4. I would not compare your DSs to their dad in a negative way. Respect them as individuals.
5. "I had the expectation that my boys as teenagers would be loving and protective of me" I think that is somewhat self centered, and unrealistic. Let it go.
Enforce your rights under the
Enforce your rights under the CO with zero tolerance for deviation. Record everything this kid says. Record his post therapy comments and play them in front of the therapist and your lying SS next time you are session.
He can either choose to be pleasant and comply with standards of reasonable behavior in your home or he can suffer..
Bare his ass as the lying manipulatorthat he is in plublic in the most humiliating ways possible. He will learn.
Welcome by the way. I hope thar you find this to be a good place to vent, contribute and to pick up some useful advice from others who are living the blended family dream.
Good luck.
Take care of you.
Not realistic
Rags, I do not think your suggestions are realistic. Your scorched earch approach may work well for people like your DW, who has money and does not live close to ec. Here, OP states that her ex has more money. Publicly humilating him may encourage dad to push for custody.
He can chose to comply with OP, or he may push to live with Dad. You leave out that alternative. I dont think OP is ignoring it. And the 12Yo may want to follow him.
While resources are an
While resources are an advantage in these siituations the CO is the ultimate tool for both the CP and the NCP.
My advice is for the OP to enforce the CO. This is a 15yo minor with no resources of his own who is a known and proven manipulative liar. The solution IMHO is to parent and confront the kid bullshit.
Scorched earth is a viable tool. And often after the scorching what grows back in that fertile environment is stronger than what grew there before.
Establishment and enforcement of guidelines should be constant in relationships . Particularly when deviant teens are involved. Deviant to the guidelines and boundaries that is.
Teens Suck
I can tell you from experience that his behavior (staying in his room) is normal for a teen. The attitude and dislike for the parent is also pretty normal. I am very close to my BS but when he was in his early teens, he liked my DH (his SF) more than me on most days. He also thought his BD was the best thing ever. In reality, his BD was lazy, unmotivated and a disney dad at best. There were times BS wanted to go live with BD but luckily my XH was too lazy to want to parent full time so it was never a real threat. However, I can say at the time I would have fought tooth and nail to keep him.
Now...That being said...I can share my experience as a SM. My SS's acted toward DH just like your BS is acting toward you. They were rude, hateful and didn't want to come over. They originally blamed their misery on me and my BS. When we disengaged and stopped interacting wtih them, they turned their vile behavior on DH alone. It took a few years for DH to stop chasing and begging them to come around. But he finally did stop. Their horrible behavior returned in one final burst where they said the most horrible things to DH you could imagine. Let me add...this was all encouraged and manipulated by BM and her SO. This final blow out happened two months ago. This past week DH got a text from BM basically begging DH to talk to the SS's because they were being terrible at her house. They were now treating BM the exact same way they treated DH. BM has had to tolerate it for a few months while DH was tortured for years....and suddenly BM begs for help. When DH asked for help from BM she told him to shove it.
My point for the story is....this can go two ways....You can let your BS go and hope that maybe your XH will reep what he sows and BS will treat him like an ass, causing XH to actually parent and coparent. OR you can fight your BS going and deal with his attitude and hatred for the next few years. Just remember, in a few years he will just be able to leave and do what he wants (go to your XH's) and there isn't much you can do about it.
What happened 2 months ago
What happened 2 months ago may I ask? And is your husband done with them?
Does the kid have any friends
Does the kid have any friends?
Except for that fact you keep trying to get him out and social some with the household and ask him to do the occasional chore. exactly what does he say he feels will be so much better at Dad's? I mean if all the kid does is hide in his cave, come out for dinner and retreat to cave until time to sleep, what does he plan to do if he were allowed to go live with Dad (he lives with Dad now 50/50, correct?)
If the kid is going to just blob around his cave at your home, what are his plans for after school and evenings (besides weekends at the club) if he were at his father's?
Do anyone (Dad and/or you) check his online/iphone activities? Ever check out his social media?
Does he have a friend (or perhaps secret GF) at Dad's? Is it as simple as Dad would let kid game all night and you won't? In other words, have you flat out asked the kid what would be so wonderful being at Dad's 24/7 day after day?
Have you talked at all with Dad as to if he and SM want the teen in their face fulltime? yes, I read the kid was making up fabrications about Dad needing to come get him immediately because kid was so afraid *gag, choke, barf*. And it's natural Dad would want to 'save' the kid from whatever torture the poor kid is enduring *rolls eyes* .... but does Dad have any idea the kid is playing him?
Have you talked to Dad about the idea the teen is depressed and inquired as to if Dad has observed anything of concern? Have you talked to the school to see if they have noticed anything and/or have any concerns ?
Your son
is challenging you. I have a bio who is 15 and he will occasionally do things like this and then I literally have to get face to face with him and chew him out until he backs down. I think it's all due to testosterone. After that he's usually back to acting like normal. Of course he will on a daily basis do the whole eye rolling sighing thing when asked to do something. I also learned he doesn't like to be told to do multiple chores , he needs it told to him one thing at a time or he can't remember item number 4. Just keep his best interests at heart. Do you think his dad would support him going to college and give him the tools necessary to do so? keep an eye on his future not what is happening right now. teenagers are moody, inconsiderate, selfish, and totally wrapped up in their own world. They also have no adult experience to compare life to so its sometimes a scarey thing.
One thing at a time is
One thing at a time is critical IMHO. So is shifting to a “show me what you did” rather than a “Did you do it?”. structure. It minimizes the lies and tension.
If they know they have to demonstrate that the one item at a time to-do list is complete it stops the telling you what they think that you want to hear crap.
Sometimes giving kids what
Sometimes giving kids what they want teaches them a lesson we cant. Right now your biggest concern is your relationship with the son. The harder you push, the harder he pushes away. No it is not your fault he is sullen and moody. It's the age, social, school pressures and hormones. But, you cant tell a kid that, as far as they are concerned it's the fault of the person they are closest to.
It may not be the worst thing in the world to let him live with dad.
1. He will find out he is still moody and miserable there as well, and since you are not there to blame most likely BD will become the scapegoat.
2. BD may become more enlightened loving with son full time and be more on board with working together with you.
3. You can take a break from being "the bad guy" who focuses on rules and discipline and focus on re-establishing your relationship with your son.