Back Again...
Hello everyone,
It’s been a long time since I’ve logged in here and I hate that I’m back. Not because of anyone here but because I failed at being the stepfather I envisioned. I originally came here to vent, then I was seeking advice to a situation I didn’t understand, step parenting. I did leave here with a lot of great advice and I thank those who offered it.
So I put that advice to work over the last year and I came up short, very short, like I wasted my time short. I won’t say my SD11 is the worst or anything like that, she’s come a long way in the six years I’ve known her and she lives with us fulltime, bio dad is long gone and her mom and I have two DD’s 3 & 1 together now.
The thing with SD is that she plays stupid with everything and we‘re stuck in a replay mode. She forgets everything, you can never tell if it’s on purpose or a lie. And the lies, jeez, she lies just to lie, then gets caught in the lie and lies more to our faces. She does this over even the smallest things, like what did you eat last night while we were out, or did you pack a good lunch for school? Then I check the fridge and what she claimed to eat is still in there untouched and with her lunchbox, I check it and it’s full of junk food. She also lies about other things too like doing her chores, cleaning her room, doing her homework and things that happen at school.
I spend so much of my time trying to help her get past the forgetfulness, explain how lying is really bad and so forth. Then she just stands there and gives me this blank stare but her eyes tell me to eff off. Or will not even give me the respect to look at me, she’ll stare off at the tv.
We gave her a time at the dinner table to talk about her day and what she’s learned in class plus whatever playground drama there is. We try so hard to include her in everything so she doesn’t feel left out. Plus she has a pretty good life, never has she needed anything and most realistic wants are fulfilled when she gets good grades. Her only real want is a cell phone but that isn’t going to happen.
The thing is, it’s so repetitive, all of it. An 11 yr. old in our minds should be a functioning person and be able to know where to be and what to wear on the occasion, when to shower, what’s an appropriate lunch, what chores you have and so forth. We don’t expect her to build a rocket ship or navigate life on her own but to at least be able to do the basic functions of life without having a parent remind you to brush your teeth every night, my 3 yr. old manages to do more than she does. She loves the attention all this brings, she eats it up and there is never enough attention to fulfill her needs. It’s exhausting!
All of this is the same stuff we’ve been dealing with for over six years now, even though we put in so much time to teach her. She’ll put the act on, say thanks, give hugs and do the exact thing again the next day. We’ve given her the benefit of the doubt for too long. We’ve done every sort of discipline you can think of and as soon as she’s back in our good graces, she does it again.
I’m done trying to help her with all this and so is her mother. I explained to DW that I will no longer be doing anything of this with her any longer and that I have two DD’s who actually need me to teach them this stuff and to spend time with them, not spending hours every night going over the same lesson with SD for the 1,000th time.
So this is what brought me to post again, I’m not necessarily looking for advice or anything but more or less just the chance to talk to others who have or are planning on disengaging.
I’ve tried everything in my power to help this kid, make her happy, move past daddy issues, be a great role model for her, provide for her like one of my own but she shut me out a long time ago and I finally took my blinders off, so now I see it clear as day. I think it was her birthday that I woke up, I took her to Disney and I barely got a thank you!
The past weekend was the best weekend I’ve had in months because I started disengaging and it felt amazing. I completely took the backseat and when she needed something, go ask your mom was the standard answer. When she didn’t do something, I walked right past it. What time is my curfew (it’s been the same for years!) go ask your mom. When DW came around for corrective actions, I took my kids for a walk or put them in the bath. OH it felt so good to stay out of it and be drama free. The funny thing is, I warned SD I was going to stop putting up with her BS and how I can’t standmore liars, the last time would be your last chance and it was. There’s so much to this story but I couldn’t possibly add it all in one post.
If I had a question, it would be the disengagement etiquette? I stopped talking to her unless asked a direct question. I say hello as I walk in but this morning I could barely muster the words good –bye.
I’m not sure how to proceed from here, I don’t want to alienate the kid but I seriously need a very long break from her. In my past, if you burn me enough, I’ll cut you from my life and it was easy. This is different, it’s an 11 year old girl. I don’t want to be her daddy anymore, I don’t want to be her friend either. As for now, I just want to spend much needed time with my kids and only focus on them.
I’ve been reading on disengagement all day and I see that it never gets better and that makes me sad. I feel for all you SPs who gave it a good fight. It appears that some put up a solid fight for many years but for me, I’ve only given 6 and I’m tired but also feeling like I’m neglecting my own daughters.
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Some of what your Sd does
Some of what your Sd does sounds like how my Ss used to be and he had/has ADHD. Do you think she could have that?
That being said, it is very frustrating to deal with and I too ended up disengaging a lot in the long run.
Thanks Dawn for the
Thanks Dawn for the comment.
I have mentioned it many times to DW but I believe she's in denial about the possibility of ADHD. That's the extent of it though and I'm happy to hear someone else say it.
So how did the disengagement work for you? Like I said, I don't want to alienate the kid, I just want to step back and let DW lead everything. Maybe the more she's doing, the more she'll want to get her tested.
Disengagement worked by
Disengagement worked by keeping me from losing my mind but I didn't do it until Ss was almost out of high school. At that point, Ss didn't really care what I did.
Ss is now graduated from college, has a job and lives with his girlfriend. We have a cordial relationship now.
Does the school see any signs of ADHD in your Sd? That would be an important factor. We also got my Ss into therapy to get him diagnosed.
Dawn, Yes that is where I’m
Dawn,
Yes that is where I’m at, losing my mind with SD. I wish it was a lot later in our relationship like yours. Unfortunately its not and why I want to disengage without cutting her completely out or as you say, have a cordial relationship.
As for the school, no signs from them. We just had a parent/ teacher conference and all is well in that aspect. The teacher did agree that the kid is high strung.
Is sounds more like you just
Is sounds more like you just are disengaging from the discipline aspect. You can still talk and interact with your SD, but you won't be the one asking her "is your lunch packed" or "did you clean your room." type of stuff.
I have an 11 year old and some days I wonder if she took her brain out and left it on her pillow. Some days I want to disengage from my own daughter and her pre-teen attitude as well. It sounds like your DW is aware and on top of your SD's issues, but maybe she needs to talk to a therapist or your SD's pediatrician to see if this is normal pre-teen type behavior.
My SD came to live with us when she was 10 full time, she lied all the time, was conniving and manipulative....but she was raised by a junkie mother and Disney dad....so her behavior was pretty understandable given her upbringing.
It sounds like this is something that you both have been dealing with for along time. Maybe it's time to be brutally honest with your spouse that whatever you guys are doing isn't working, and that you need help from an outside source.
Only.2 Yes I want to
Only.2
Yes I want to disengage from the discipline aspect and the repetitiveness of SD’s ways. As I stated in my post, there is a lot more with plenty of layers to weed through. I agree with you about children being forgetful and I’m completely ok and understanding to that but this isn’t that. Does she actually forget something, absolutely but the repetitiveness of it is not possible, it can’t be.
You said, conniving and manipulative, this girl is that 100%. I’m not saying all day, every day but she does act like that.
I agree with needed additional help though.
I was also thinking ADHD when
I was also thinking ADHD when you mentioned the forgetfulness and the lies. Sometimes, kids with ADHD lie to try to hide their disability - either to hide that they can't remember, hide their impulsiveness, hide that they weren't paying attention. Forgetfulness and other problems with executive functioning are also common in children with ADHD. If she's really struggling, then I'm not sure why her mother is reluctant to have her evaluated, especially if she is frustrated, too, as you indicate. ADHD doesn't have to be a bad thing, it's something that can improve with treatment. She wouldn't let her daughter suffer with chronic asthma without treatment, so she shouldn't be opposed to treating a chronic neurological condition.
With regard to your DW, when you say that "we" have put in time to help her - what is her mother doing or not doing?
I understand your frustration, because I too, put in a lot of effort - to help with homework, to try to teach my SSs to be respectful, to try to teach them that working hard will ultimately make you feel better when you achieve something. I also try to be kind and helpful to them, but only get a hello, good-bye, or thank you when DH requests it of them.
I can't say I've totally disengaged, but I have worked hard to let myself off the hook when it comes to their behavior, their schoolwork, etc. I just tell myself, "I can only do so much and they are not my kids, so I don't have to feel as if I failed if they have bad grades, if they're rude, if they are entitled, etc." That doesn't solve all my problems, but it has helped me to mentally let myself off the hook. I still engage with my SSs when they are with us, but I don't go out of my way to accommodate them or to push my life aside when they are around.
Proud of you..for
Proud of you..for disengaging.....
http://www.steptogether.org/disengaging.html
read this, you can talk to your wife about it or not, I did not tell SO, I simply started doing it....
The problem i see in this whole issue, not some kind of alphabet illness... there's no consequences for her behavior... you tell her something and she stares at the TV? Oh hell no, I would switch the TV off and she will not have screen time, she will first complete what ever before she can have her phone, tv or what else...
home work needs to be shown, if not, sorry there's consequences young lady...
SD plays stupid, it's part of manipulation and she's winning....
SD - could you please clean your room (see you are not telling her, you are asking and it's her choice to decide NO)
it should be - SD clean your room now... she ignores it, consequences, you walk in there with a black bag and trash everything.
SD - Oh sorry mummy I forgot how to do homework, pack my lunch, brush my teeth....
currently you and DW keeps on telling her how important it is to remember, bull shit Sir... where's the consequences?
It's not going to work if your wife keeps on letting SD get away with stuff, it only causes SD to ignore you more and more, cause your wife is showing clearly your word does not count, either the 2 off you are on the same page, or you disengage 100%
Acratopotes, Thank you for
Acratopotes,
Thank you for reading between the lines in my post. I tried to add a few talking points that show my issues without opening the floodgates and writing a book to describe the SD.
Correct, she stares off at the tv when it’s on and I’m trying to talk to her. Once she did it while playing a video game and I ripped the play station out from the cords and she didn’t get it back for a month. (It was my play station) I fully explained the proper way to address and adult if she was playing, push pause and look at the adult. So she knew because I taught her and did it anyway.
Although I kinda agree with the other posters as a possible alphabet illness might be there, in my mind, it doesn’t matter as to how you act towards your parents. And after she’s been taught so much but everytime the wind blows, she plays “I foooorgot”
“SD plays stupid, it's part of manipulation and she's winning....” You are correct!
“SD - could you please clean your room (see you are not telling her, you are asking and it's her choice to decide NO)” This is already the long fight I/we put in and I finally won. I told her I would take away her very nice bunkbed that I bought her if she didn’t keep her room clean. She didn’t and after a year or so playing the game, we decided to play one with her, good cop/bad cop. So I went in her room and took it apart right in front of her. She cried to her mom and made the promise she’d never do it again. So then DW came in her room and we had a fake talk. I put it back together while DW lectured her about how it better stay clean. It’s been a year and the room has been spotless.
So no, no excuses.
“Where’s the consequences?” They’re there, they just are not working long term. If when she’s grounded, she’s an angel but under your feet. A few days to a few weeks after she gets off grounding, she does the exact thing that got her in trouble. Like lie or cheat or whatever the case is.
I’m still trying to figure out what my role is going to be moving forward. I can’t lie, it’s been amazing taking the backseat with SD. I think sometimes bio’s forget that its not your kid and happily let you lead but even leaders need some R&R off the frontlines of the battlefield.
FYI… I do like your attitude though. Let’s chat more, thanks!
I am shocked... the room
:jawdrop: I am shocked...
the room cleaning thing, although you and DW thought you are handling it correctly with good cop/bad cop - step back and look at it, You and DW showed SD.. Sir can say what he wants, mummy will talk to him and it will not happen... (sorry but this is what the child see)
grounded?? and she's an angel under your feet, clever girl bug the shit out of them and they will lift the grounding, oh no, when she's grounded, she's grounded to her room..... she can only leave her room to use the bathroom and meal times... yes jail... currently your grounding tactics is blown off, so make it tougher...
Kid tells fables, not much you can do about it lol, I even tried shunning mine... did not work, then we compromised, if he lies to me and gets into trouble, he should handle it on his own, eg - home work not done... consequences, detention in school, no lift home, have to walk, still do chores etc.
If he honestly tells me, he did not do his home work cause he did not feel like it, I will say - fine... get your books let's attempt it... even if it's 11pm at night.... and no staying at home the next day cause you are tired.. sorry you had enough time to do your homework during the after noon.. he quickly learned his lessons lol... eventually I let the little white lies slide...
Deigma why do you smell like smoke.... My friends smoke ma... (yes bigger and you as well... he did not really lie but he did not tell the truth)
I merely said - if you want to smoke, smoke (age16) but you will buy with your money and only at home, not in public and not in your school uniform.. he denied he's smoking till age 18.. but we knew he was puffing away behind the shed lol
Does your wife know anything
Does your wife know anything about your plans to disengage? I ask because you say you have been in your SD's life for 6 years now and have tried very hard to be a father figure, role model etc. If you go from 100% to 2% engagement, your wife is most likely to take offense and she will start to feel like she needs to (over)compensate for the other 98% that you used to give.
I was just like you when I first me skids. They were 8 and 9. I tried so hard with them, really just to be a good role model and "friend" and when our BS7 was born, I don't know if they got jealous or if it was just their ages at that time (10 and 11) or what happened, but there was a huge paradigm shift. And any relationship that we had went out the proverbial window. When they started disrespecting me (SD was stealing from me, lying, calling me a bitch behind my back, SS was saying he wished I leave etc) I decided to disengage and focus solely on MY child.. you know the one who actually loves me, respects me etc.
When this happened, DH did NOT like it. He felt that they were just "being kids" and that I needed to be the adult and get over the things they were doing and instead of talking to them about THEIR actions, he attacked me every chance he got for not talking to them enough, not smiling at them enough, not being interested in them enough, not acting like "a mother" to them. well they didn't need another "mother" they both have mothers; albeit shitty ones, but what can I do about that? You can't force yourself into a relationship with someone. It just doesn't work that way. If skids didn't like me or want me around, then I sure as shit wasn't going to go out of my way to do anything for them.
My SD20 was/is a HUGE liar. She lies about everything to the point that along with the lying and other things she does, I firmly believe that she is a sociopath. But my SD was 14 when she moved in with us, up until then she always lived with BM/GBM and they are the ones who taught her to lie, because they are the Queens of Lying-Manipulation Town. I wonder when/how your SD became such a liar? Does your wife correct her/punish her on it?
I tried to read through a lot
I tried to read through a lot of things that you posted. I am new to the whole step-life as for the parent thing.
I am not new as for being a skid. My parents divorced when I was your daughters age. My bio-dad was a piece of crap. Trying to bond because you did not have a dad was not a good idea and will never be a good idea. She will deal with it in her own way and navigate it herself. All you can do is be there if she ever comes to you no need to address it or ask about or bring it up to her. Yes there will be signs that it has caused issues but just do not always blame things on that or say that to her.
If she uses that as a excuse, shut it down so fast that she get whip lash. Plenty of kids out there have crap parents and manage and function fully in life.
Maybe you guys do ask her to do a little too much. I do not know a single 11 year old that will pack themselves a healthy lunch. My SS9 does the forgetful thing to when he gets caught in a lie. Part of it can be an age thing and she is pre-teen. She is at an age where things are going to be very hard for all of you. Especially because she does have the daddy issues.
Disengaging might help but truth is it could also back fire hard core. Does your wife know you are trying to disengage?