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Interesting article.

bananaseedo's picture

https://www.theguardian.com/lifeandstyle/2017/feb/11/breaking-taboo-pare...

I found this so spot on!

He dislikes the “cult of motherhood”, which, he says, has come so much to the fore in the last decade. “Originally it was God that was going to save us from ourselves, then it was love, and now it’s children. It’s the product of the divorce era. Up until then, we could believe that falling in love means happily ever after. Now we’ve tested the love-is-for-ever myth and found a replacement: that a child is going to love us for ever, make us feel happy, secure and successful.” When, after the birth of a child, these elated states of being don’t come to pass, it could create feelings of unmentionable regret.

Anyone care to discuss?

Comments

fairyo's picture

I didn't read it all (it is quite long) but I do think it is a taboo subject that should be treated with a little caution.
First of all nature is still in control of our reproductive functions- to a certain extent we can prevent pregnancy, encourage it, abort unwanted ones, and reproduce it in a clinical setting, but I think we fool ourselves into thinking childbirth, and then subsequently children, can be fully controlled by we rather deluded humans.
The other day I had to listen to my own son sobbing down the phone because he had come to realise he may never have children- not not he's incapable (his girlfriend has lost two babies) but that his girlfriend may choose not to for health reasons. I told him it is her choice, and he has to come to terms with staying with her and facing childlessness, or breaking up and looking elsewhere. I told him that women are not baby factories, that he shouldn't choose to be with a woman because of her fertility abilities- that he could spend his whole life looking for someone to father his children and failing.
Nature sometimes chooses for us- and sometimes we don't like it- it is arbitrary, random and sometimes seem so unfair.
That said, I think some of these women are talking about a lack of bonding with their children which seems to be a 'natural' thing too and maybe needs more study and certainly needs more talking about. Lionel Shriver tried to do this in 'We need to talk about Kevin,' although I had problems with the more sensationalist aspects of this novel.
Other women, though, seem to be speaking about the societal expectations of motherhood- that women are expected to be caring, nurturing individuals who will/should give up their careers and lifestyle when they produce their young.
We feel far too little that women should come out and rectify their issues in a social sphere and change things for themselves- we don't need to assume that because we are in the home caring for children, that we should be doing all the housework for example. This is just one example, but we could site so many...
I think we do not value mothers enough, not that we value them too much... and that to me is the issue but maybe I missed the point.
Sorry this has been a long post, but you did ask for opinions! This is just mine!

TwoOfUs's picture

Interesting article, indeed.

If biomoms can start admitting they regret their offspring...maybe one day society will even allow stepmoms to admit they regret having stepkids without jumping down their throats, raking them over the coals, and calling them horrible names.

Hahahahahahaha! We can dream, right?

beebeel's picture

I don't have time to finish the whole thing right now. I kept thinking "do these women have terrible friends or just dishonest women in their family?"

Maybe its because I was 34 when I had my son, but I had plenty of people tell me motherhood isn't always love muffins and unicorn kisses. And sure, when they handed me the wrinkled, purple lump that I gave birth to, I remember thinking, "What the hell was I thinking! Am I going to be a good parent? I'm afraid of failing something for the first time ever!"

Some people regret becoming parents. Some people regret never having kids. Me? Regret is useless. Instead of wallowing in the self pity party of regret, I do think people need to get over it. Those poor kids. Could you imagine your parents writing a book or blog all about how much they regret having you? Obviously, these people should have never been parents. And they blame everyone else (society, men, their friends) for having unrealistic expectations. Bull.

lieutenant_dad's picture

I don't know why it shocks people so much that humans would regret having offspring. We regret marrying the people we marry, buying the house we live in, getting that tattoo over Spring Break, changing out hair stylists, etc. Changing any aspect of your life comes with the possibility that you'll regret having done it.

Parenting is one of the few choices we make that we have next-to-no context of what it is actually going to be like until it happens. When it does happen, there is no good way of fixing it. You can't legally sell your kid like you could a house. You can't erase them like you can a tattoo (now, anyway). You can't switch back to your old life legally; even if you run away, if you're ever caught, you'll have years of back CS to pay. The only ways of "getting out" of parenthood are to abort a pregnancy, sign over a child for adoption, or wait until they are adults and disappear then.

So then you end up with people who regret having children, who have no real recourse, and they have to figure out how to not screw up someone they do love while burying their own shame and discontent. I honestly think the recent rise in "helicopter parenting" and "Pinterest momming" is due to parents feeling regret but not wanting a world that is CONSTANTLY looking at them through social media, instant communication via texts and phone calls, etc. to know it. They overcompensate and turn parenthood into a contest. Kids get treated like friends because you don't regret your friends as hastily you would someone that is constantly screaming at you, crying, demanding your attention, needing your care, etc. You keep them happy like you do a friend, and then it's much easier to not regret them. The downfall, though, is that kids are ever-changing, and when they thrive on instant gratification and shiny new things, a parent has to keep up to keep them happy. So parents are constantly overdoing it, throwing money, compliments, toys, clothes, big birthday parties, etc. to make their kids happy. To make that relationship easy. To make everyone friends and cordial.

If more people could admit that they regret having kids but still know they are responsible for their upkeep without recourse, I think much of today's parenting problems would disappear. Think about it: here on STalk, we stepparents can come and vent where others understand. Others validate our feelings and offer advice on how to correct the problem. Many times when said advice is followed, the poster sees a dramatic improvement in their own life, and many times in the life of their stepchild. It would be WONDERFUL to see a similar response to parents, who can admit that they regret their kids and vent and ask for help, and have other people validate their feelings and offering healthy coping mechanisms. Kids would stop thinking they are the center of the universe, parents would be able to put parenting back into their lives as one of many roles they play versus THE role they play, and we might see fewer over-the-top parenting expectations that come from assuaging guilt, not better parenting.

It's perfectly acceptable to regret your decisions. You still have to own those decisions, which means you still have to care for your child and raise them to be respectable members of society. Kids will pick up on regret whether you say it out loud or not, so you might as well do your best with them and let them know you did the best you could. That you do love them. That you want what is best for them. But that, if you had to do it all over again, you might not make the same choice given the knowledge you have now.

I'll end with an analogy regarding my car. I like my car. It's a good little car. I take it in for oil changes and other maintenance. I was livid when someone ran a stop sign and damaged my front bumper. I get annoyed when I find nails in my tires, or find nails in a parking lot that could damage MY car. I'd be beyond peeved and upset if someone stole it. I have put a lot of money into my car to keep it running and working, and my plan is to keep it running and working long enough to pass it along to one of the SSs.

However, I regret buying my car. It was an impulsive buy that I made when I was in an emotionally compromised state. It wasn't really practical when I bought it, and it's not practical now. I think about the money I could have saved if I bought something used, or the money I will save when I eventually have to go buy something bigger if I had just bought bigger to begin with. The maintenance is more expensive than I imagined because of the size and type of car it is. There are just a lot of things that make buying that car a bad choice.

However, all because the choice I made was the wrong one doesn't mean that I'm going to go plow my car into a tree or sell it when I'm upside down on it, either being a mistake on top of a regret. I have to live with the decision that I made, and that means I take responsibility of the car I purchased. I'm not going to let the brakes go out so that I can't stop and damage someone else's car - or hurt me in the process. I will do what I need to do to keep it running and safe. In the end, I will still like my car. I will always like my car, and have fond memories of my car, and will be a little sad the first time I hand it over to one of the SSs or a new owner because it's MY car. But none of that will ever change the regret I have for purchasing it in the first place.

bananaseedo's picture

Wonderful words! Yes, very much so. I think the women in the article WERE doing what you said-taking responsibility and still loving their kids and raising them.

Personally_ though I was very bonded w/my sons and love them, I often wonder what life would be had I stayed child-free.

They are also a lot of heartache and stress when they hit teenage years-So I probably feel different now then I did when they were younger or might when they are older.

I think it's harder for moms to admit, DH has NO problem saying he never wanted kids and would have been happier w/out SD- He said he should have just had dogs. He's a great doggy daddy- EXCEPT I do see some traits of how he raises SD. He's not big on discipline or doing things the dog NEEDS for us to all co-exist better. He doesn't crate him like he should- he needs to train him w/his e-collar or prong and doesn't - he doesn't OPPOSE any of it btw. He doesn't want to hear the dogs discontent or whining in the crate for example so he'll just leave him lose in the house all day and complains he can't get anything done-well DUH you're behind him 100pct to avoid his crimes lol.

Dogs will do what they can get away with-just like kids. I felt bad but I went OFF on him on a text rant about how he was raising our pup just like he did SD - like a feral cat w/no boundaries, no discipline, no rules. He at least finally washed out big kennel-and guess who got him in there for an hour yesterday while we watched a movie? This gal! lol- he whined a few mins but calmed down.

I'm actually not bad at parenting- I am strict-I do have rules-I do raise my voice harshly at times with a stern NO or STOP or WATCH YOUR MOUTH -whether it's the boys OR the dog. If I weren't the disciplinarian all hell would break lose.

IN saying all this- I think for ME-the regret I have is more having chosen the wrong dad for the boys- I wanted an equal partner that would help raise them- that didn't work so it was all left to me. Then came DH and SD- I wanted an equal partner in a 'same approach' to all kids when it came to rules/expectations but he always would lax on all of them-and I was always AGAIN the bad guy. I have to be the bad guy w/the dog too....(though he still prefers me over DH LOL) So, yeah, it's more regret not having the right partners to equally have the tough parts BUT enjoy the good times or sometimes be the nice guy and let the other parent tackle the hard shi*. If parenting hadn't been so tough on me all the time then I may have enjoyed it more.

Holly's picture

THANK YOU for explaining that so clearly and carefully!! Exactly this!! I read this article thinking "thank God it's not just me" - my kids are in their 20's and I love them to bits but I have felt like a freak for all those years, not being able to admit that I love my children, I just found being a mother... miserable.

beebeel's picture

I think if people took more time to make huge decisions, such as who they will have kids with and when to have them, there would be less regret. Regret is the fuel for guilt and we all know too well how guilt can screw up kids.

But too many people dive right into these decisions without proper preparation or fully vetting their partner and yeah...regret will happen.

ETA: And I think the realities of parenting are easily observed. Kids meltdown in stores, restaurants, airports and public bathrooms all the time. My girlfriends regaled me with horror stories of no sleep, constant noise, property damage, the list was endless. Since I can remember, "Some people's kids!" Has been a popular cliche. If people honestly thought parenting was going to be magical from birth to grave, they must be living under a rock lol.

Gwynnafaye's picture

I don't regret my children, not one bit. I love them both more than life. However, I worry about them - ALL THE TIME. Especially my son who is living on his own and struggles doing it. Sometimes, I help. Sometimes, I let him figure things out on his own. Parenting is the hardest thing I have ever done. I have good kids, even my skids. They all work. The boys have launched and are doing okay. They struggle, but they're young and just starting out. My SD will go to college. My DD probably won't, and that's okay. I will never regret them, but if I could go back in time and do it all over again, I don't know if I would have children of my own. The worry and stress (right now) is a lot to handle, sometimes too much. My mom and my aunt tell me that the worry never goes away.

WTF...REALLY's picture

I love love love my two kids. Deeply enjoyed raising them. My youngest goes to college in about six months and I’m going to miss him terribly. But I’m incredibly proud of the people my two children have turned into. Zero regrets.

And my life and self-esteem does not revolve around them. I have my life that is different in their life. But the three of us support each other at all times.